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We're Shutting Down and I'm Scared

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Re: We're Shutting Down and I'm Scared

#61

Post by dwaltrip »

na85 wrote: post #32
tptacek wrote: post #18

Been there. * If your payables and debts are all in the company's name, nobody is coming for your house. The likelihood that your business was going to die before you could pay all your debts was priced into your contracts. If you have employees, pay them and get them off your books first; employee wages are, depending on the state you're in, the one likely exception to that rule. * If they were in your name, well, t…

>Why do you care? You know, some personality types cannot help but be concerned with how they're perceived by others. They're hardwired that way. It's the classic misunderstanding between extraverts and introverts.

I would argue 99% of people care a great deal, whether they like to admit it or not. We are social creatures. Caring about these things (within some range) also gives a higher chance for reproductive success, so as you said, we are hard-wired to care.

Re: We're Shutting Down and I'm Scared

#64

Post by mindotus »

If you are in the NYC area coffee or drinks on me! Just shoot me an email to john@minus.com

Just remember it's not the end and there is much more to look forward to perhaps in a future startup months or years down the road.

Re: We're Shutting Down and I'm Scared

#65

Post by tunesmith »

poulsbohemian wrote: post #46
JoshTriplett wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Lots of LLCs turn themselves into S Corps, because (a) there's an old sketchy tax dodge about self-employment/FICA tax you can do as an S Interesting. Got a pointer to details on that?

See your accountant for advice on this point. Disclaimer: I am not an accountant, nor is my business set up as an S corp. The way it works is this: you form an S corp, and as the owner you pay yourself dividends rather than straight income. That way you aren't taxed at normal income tax rates but instead at the capital gains rate. At the same time, because you are now an employee of the S corp you personally only pay…

I think this is incorrect in two ways - you do still have to pay yourself salary, and dividends are taxed at normal income rates (due to pass-through) rather than capital gains rates. It's unfortunate that they are called dividends, because stock dividends are taxed at capital gains rates.

Re: We're Shutting Down and I'm Scared

#66

Post by ThomPete »

patio11 wrote: post #34
tptacek wrote: post #18

Been there. * If your payables and debts are all in the company's name, nobody is coming for your house. The likelihood that your business was going to die before you could pay all your debts was priced into your contracts. If you have employees, pay them and get them off your books first; employee wages are, depending on the state you're in, the one likely exception to that rule. * If they were in your name, well, t…

In addition to Thomas being right about employee wages being able to "pierce the veil" in many states, they're the people most at risk in this situation, so you owe it to them to make sure they're taken care of. It's the one circumstance where I would backstop a company problem with personal funds. (If your company was also behind on e.g. rent or hosting, on the other hand, that risk was priced into contractual terms…

Agree.

Not paying yourself is fooling yourself into believing you have a sustainable business.

What you have is a source of revenue (not income) and it should be mentally in the "side projects" category. I.e. you should probably have a job and do this on the side.

The stories about people who didn't pay themselves but finally made it are far between and is not recommended IMHO.

Re: We're Shutting Down and I'm Scared

#67

Post by aaronpeck »

I think what you're going to find out is letting go will actually be a huge relief. You're going to bumble around feeling like a worthless piece of shit for a few weeks and then ideas will start boiling over in your mind. Before you know it you'll be writing a business plan or prototyping something new and you'll be armed with this failure as a roadmap of what not to do. You sir will be a-ok.

PS. Not having any money at least once in your life is something everyone should go through. You'll be surprised at how well you eat and live when you thought you'd be homeless. You'll also realize how much bullshit you have in your house or services you pay for that you really don't need. Good luck - you won't need it.

Re: We're Shutting Down and I'm Scared

#68

Post by dkersten »

tptacek wrote: post #18

Been there. * If your payables and debts are all in the company's name, nobody is coming for your house. The likelihood that your business was going to die before you could pay all your debts was priced into your contracts. If you have employees, pay them and get them off your books first; employee wages are, depending on the state you're in, the one likely exception to that rule. * If they were in your name, well, t…

Having been through shutting down my previous startup just a few months ago I can say that my experience mirrors this quite closely. Its scary and stressful at the time, but at the end of the day, nothing bad happened and nobody ridiculed us. In fact, everybody (including our investors - some of which are involved with us again) was quite positive and everybody sees it as a positive learning experience. And being able to say that we're on our second startup has been beneficial too.

Re: We're Shutting Down and I'm Scared

#70

Post by oscargrouch »

GuiA wrote: post #17

Hi! As your post seems to indicate, you're scared shitless right now and it seems like the entire world is coming to an end. Trust me, even if it really seems that way, it's not. For now, grit your teeth and go through the bad stuff. Tell your wife. Be honest with her. No matter what, she's your wife for a reason- she'll support you through all of this. If you neglected your relationship with her a bit because of the…

i thinks this piece of advice its cool in almost all of it.. but there are some pieces of it that i think sounds a little overoptimistic:

> she's your wife for a reason- she'll support you through all of this

Maybe not.. a lot of marriages brake because of financial bankrupcy.. but this guy will have to face it anyway.. it will depend of how much the materialistic/spiritual type she is and how much she love him.. this will be definetly a good proof of love from her, if she stands up with him... (but these sort of people are rare)

> they(investors) will remember your honesty and ethics more than the fact that your startup failed

I think it will be harder for him to raise funds later if he try to do it again some other time.. but nothing that will do things impossible for him.. also there are other ways (you know, companies existed before VC funding :)) .. but maybe this make his charisma and charm to raise even more money.. like superpowers that come from a mature characther

This guy need to face the truth no matter how hard its gonna be.. and i dont think trying to make things look better will help him much.. there are times life sucks, and this can be a proof of the strenght or weakness of our character..

Let me make it clear that you advices are very nice.. i was just spoting some overoptimism in some areas and i dont think in that particular case, this would help.. its reality time for him now.. time to take the red pill .. the blue pill will only make things worse..

Again, everything can serve for good in our experiences.. even, and specially the ones that are bad.. it needs a superior point of view to spot the good things from everything and make ourselves better.. but we have a lot of examples out there of people that just can't see the things that way.. and never "come back".. its important to know this and never be one of them..

Its the end of a war or its just the end of a battle in life?

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