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What is really happening in Ukraine

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Re: What is really happening in Ukraine

#141

Post by [deleted] »

afsina wrote: post #102
mathetic wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I cannot account for what's happening in Ukraine but last time a video like this one released in Istanbul during protests, it was undercover police throwing molotov cocktails to armoured police vehicles. It was the only video shown by all the news agencies [0]. It is quite funny that a community of skeptics being pedantic on silliest social networking apps takes what they see in a video for granted and makes harsh ju…

`undercover police throwing molotov cocktails` -> citation needed.

[deleted]

Re: What is really happening in Ukraine

#142

Post by swamp40 »

afsina wrote: post #102
mathetic wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I cannot account for what's happening in Ukraine but last time a video like this one released in Istanbul during protests, it was undercover police throwing molotov cocktails to armoured police vehicles. It was the only video shown by all the news agencies [0]. It is quite funny that a community of skeptics being pedantic on silliest social networking apps takes what they see in a video for granted and makes harsh ju…

`undercover police throwing molotov cocktails` -> citation needed.

Here you go: http://www.policymic.com/articles/79771/this-photo-is-going-...

Re: What is really happening in Ukraine

#143

Post by vitalique »

Demiurge wrote: post #87
akjj wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Protestors weren't taking over government buildings during G8 conferences.

That's a good point, but they would have, if they had lots of small unguarded municipal buildings. Not to be sarcastic, this is still just a few thousands of extremists being destructive. A Civil War is when you have armed forces on both sides, a big population willing to take arms. Most adult people want this to stop and get back to work.

> this is still just a few thousands of extremists being destructive... Most adult people want this to stop and get back to work.

I'm not even going to ask you how exactly do you know this, because this is completely untrue. There are hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of Ukrainians who already actively expressed their support to current shift in Ukrainian political landscape and their distrust to corrupt politicians currently in charge of the country, call it a war or a revolution. Arguing that and calling them "few thousands of extremists" is laughable - just have a look at any of the livestreams. Also, most adult people are at work. Ukraine is a big country.

From your comments I conclude that they have some agenda behind them. You are either trolling, deliberately trying to misinform HN community, or doing both of those things.

Re: What is really happening in Ukraine

#144

Post by dmytrish »

Igor_TN wrote: post #42
steven2012 wrote: post #18

I heard that there are a lot of nukes in Ukraine and the last thing the world wants is those split off into separate hands. I would harbor a guess that the US would rather have those nukes in the hands of Russia, who is a known evil but rational, vs someone else entirely new. I read on Stratfor that Russia does not want Ukraine to become independent because it's basically the "soft underbelly" leading into Russia. It…

All nukes went from Ukraine to Russia (same in other former Soviet republics) after the Soviet Union broke apart. It all was regulated by proper treaties. You should not listen to rumors. Regarding your next statement, Russia is not interfering in what is happening in Ukraine AT ALL. As opposed to EU and US who send their emissaries to Ukraine very often. The only "interference" from Russia is giving to Ukraine a hug…

There are multiple rumors about Russian forces disguised as Berkut, there are some evidences about Russian snipers here, there are videos of some military forces of non-Ukrainian origin in Southern Ukraine, etc. I don't give this full credibility (usual rumors in time of unrest, perhaps), but still there's no smoke without fire.

Re: What is really happening in Ukraine

#145

Post by GhotiFish »

egao1980 wrote: post #137

Simple question - if somebody is protesting for more than 2 month where does he/she get money from? Leaving us with 2 major groups - unemployed/homeless and students. Unemployed people are suffering in every country, but putting enthusiasm into looking for a job for 2.5 months would most likely solve their problem. Students are stupid, and gullible, I know, I've been one :)

?

This is the first time I've heard jobs mentioned about the protest.

Re: What is really happening in Ukraine

#146

Post by davidw »

D9u wrote: post #84
sethbannon wrote: post #74

People being kidnapped from hospital beds and tortured by their own government. It's hard to imagine a more depraved situation.

How about drone strikes which target and kill a US citizen and his teenage son?

Is there a name for the internet law that pretty much any discussion of a country doing something unseemly manages to drag the US into the discussion?

Re: What is really happening in Ukraine

#147

Post by curtis »

crypt1d wrote: post #125

Frankly, this "presentation" feels like a 13-year old made it for his homework assignment. Poor language skills, not many details and unreliable evidence. I got to the 10th slide and gave up. This is definitely not something I would use to form an opinion on the current situation in Ukraine.

> Poor language skills ...

Poor English skills. However, there's a good chance that the writer is not a native English speaker.

Re: What is really happening in Ukraine

#148

Post by LekkoscPiwa »

gfodor wrote: post #112
hobbes wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The choice you are making between different ways of dying has nothing do to with the point being made.

And the point being made has nothing to do with the protests in Ukraine.

However, it is shocking that in America governed by a Nobel Peace Prize Winner we do things that put us on the level of Ukrainian Government, i.e. killing your own citizens without trial based on President's "gut feeling". Disgusting.

Re: What is really happening in Ukraine

#149

Post by madamepsychosis »

davidw wrote: post #146
D9u wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about drone strikes which target and kill a US citizen and his teenage son?

Is there a name for the internet law that pretty much any discussion of a country doing something unseemly manages to drag the US into the discussion?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/And_you_are_lynching_Negroes

Re: What is really happening in Ukraine

#150

Post by gtrubetskoy »

dmytrish wrote: post #88
gtrubetskoy wrote: post #67

What is really happening in Ukraine is that both sides of this conflict (pro-Euro and against) are absolutely corrupt and the people know it. The tragedy of this is that no one from the government or opposition represents the will of the people. The population of Ukraine really just wants an end to corruption and a better national identity, euro-integration was just the last straw, but not fundamental to this crisis…

Yes, you're right that Ukrainian opposition is still a part of the corrupt system, but there's a hope that Klichko (who lived in Europe for a long time) is a fresh blood here. Also, current Yanukovych's and Party of Regions corruption is outrageous even for Ukraine. This is the true reason of the revolution. People fight with the state sincerely, I don't see much sane people who are sincerely supporting Yanukovych no…

Klichko doesn't strike me as an honest person, he's as corrupt as the next guy, but that's just MHO.
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