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Texas Public Schools Are Teaching Creationism

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Re: Texas Public Schools Are Teaching Creationism

#91

Post by DanBC »

michaeldhopkins wrote: post #74
mschuster91 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Applying common sense should be enough. You as a parent have neither the time nor the knowledge of all the various subjects that are taught in school, not to mention a proper paedagogic/teaching education.

That is not true. Parents use quality textbooks and lesson plans. They also get together to pay specialists to teach difficult subjects one or more times per week. Also, by the time a homeschooled child is of the age that their subjects can only be taught by specialists, they either know how to teach themselves or take courses from local junior colleges or correspondence courses. There is no one proper pedagogy. Teac…

You point about abuse is incorrect. Abuse (physical, sexual, or emotional abuse, or neglect) is more likely to happen in the home, perpetrated by a family member.

I'm not sure why it's a reason to avoid home schooling. Schools are not great at spotting and reporting abuse.

Re: Texas Public Schools Are Teaching Creationism

#92

Post by singlow »

stonemetal wrote: post #19
cobrausn wrote: post #3

So, as someone who went to a private (Catholic, even) high school in Texas that taught evolution, I'm often pretty frustrated by this. Aside from just waiting for those who set these kinds of policies in place to fade away, is there any specific voting pattern that would stop this? I don't live in areas that vote in people who set these policies, so I'm not sure I can actually even affect this.

If you are still in Texas you have some control. The state board of education determine Curriculum and instructional materials. Board members are elected so your vote and campaign contributions would have an effect.

I don't think that board's decisions are directly affecting this charter school though. The decisions they make effect the curriculum used by public schools.

While this school receives public funding, it operates largely as a private school, with curriculum chosen by its own board. There are certain mandates that they must fulfill, and a general plan which must be approved by the state education board in their initial charter. In order to rescind their charter, the board would need to determine that their curriculum does not meet the plan outlined in their charter or that the students are not be prepared adequately for college. It appears from the information in the article that the science of evolution is taught and the students would, presumably, be able to answer test questions regarding it. They just aren't asked to believe it is fact.

Re: Texas Public Schools Are Teaching Creationism

#93

Post by angersock »

lukethomas wrote: post #44
mschuster91 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Allowing home schooling is even more sick than that kind of bullshit these Texans are doing. In public schools one at least knows what the teachers are teaching. Home-schooled kids are not protected from anything ranging from creationist crap to domestic violence (you as a teacher can spot if a pupil turns up beaten every other day). Not to mention the fact that home-schooled kids are far, far behind "ordinary school…

I was homeschooled growing up. My brother graduated high school with 36 college credits (dual enrollment), I graduated with 23, and my younger sister graduated with 26. It was like we went to college for a semester before even graduating. Somehow I managed to graduated university with high honors (sister is in civil engineering on a full-boat scholarship, top of her class, brother got a full boat as well.) Lastly, my…

right but youre probably a christian and anti vaxxer and probably dont even believe in evolution

you voted for bush didnt you

Re: Texas Public Schools Are Teaching Creationism

#94

Post by fennecfoxen »

xradionut wrote: post #78
Karunamon wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

..how on earth do you figure creationism is a threat to an open society?

It's a blatant falsehood.

Indeed! We must ensure that our harmonious society has no tolerance for falsehoods, only for the Truth. For the truth is... North Korea is best Korea.

Re: Texas Public Schools Are Teaching Creationism

#95

Post by daedalus_j »

sergiotapia wrote: post #40
Karunamon wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to mention the fact that home-schooled kids are far, far behind "ordinary schooled" kids in terms of knowledge. Citation badly needed.

I've never really met a "normal" home schooled person. Either they are incredibly naive, or really odd, or behave strange when in a group. There are certain things you pick when you go to school, just by being among other people.

Indeed there are. Bad habits like drinking, smoking, drugs, teenage pregnancy, and how to assault teachers in the parking lot.

These were all extremely common things in the school district where I grew up, which is why my parents, (and the parents of many others in the area) chose to homeschool their children. I never learned those things by "just being among other people" and I think I'm better for it. (My state-required yearly standardized testing scores growing up, that I started college at 16, and the leadership positions in social organizations I’ve held most of my life seem to bear this out.)

Being "around people" is not exclusive to public school kids, nor is it some sort of magical indicator for life success. In addition, homeschooling isn’t exclusively the domain of religious zealotry and terrible people. There are plenty of us who you've met who are perefectly "normal", and may even lack some of the usual bad habits. Please update your stereotype database. :-)

Re: Texas Public Schools Are Teaching Creationism

#96

Post by angersock »

sergiotapia wrote: post #40
Karunamon wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to mention the fact that home-schooled kids are far, far behind "ordinary schooled" kids in terms of knowledge. Citation badly needed.

I've never really met a "normal" home schooled person. Either they are incredibly naive, or really odd, or behave strange when in a group. There are certain things you pick when you go to school, just by being among other people.

I've never really met a "normal" engineer. Either they are incredibly naive, or really odd, or behave strange when in a group.

There are certain things you pick when you study liberal arts, just by being among other English majors.

Re: Texas Public Schools Are Teaching Creationism

#97

Post by lukethomas »

mattgoldman wrote: post #90
lukethomas wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was homeschooled growing up. My brother graduated high school with 36 college credits (dual enrollment), I graduated with 23, and my younger sister graduated with 26. It was like we went to college for a semester before even graduating. Somehow I managed to graduated university with high honors (sister is in civil engineering on a full-boat scholarship, top of her class, brother got a full boat as well.) Lastly, my…

Hey Luke, that's awesome :-) how were the social aspects? How did you guys make friends along the way? Via sports/activities?

Growing up we went to the local public school and took art and physical education.

In high school, I played varsity soccer, and ran track at nearby public school, so I knew most of the kids there.

I also worked often, and met quite a few people that way.

If I could change anything about my social activities, it would be to live closer to where things actually happened. Growing up in the middle of nowhere in Maine gets boring :)

Re: Texas Public Schools Are Teaching Creationism

#98

Post by Xdes »

DanielStraight wrote: post #73

I really think both sides get this issue very wrong. Creationism is not valid science, obviously. But that's because it isn't science at all. It is a religious belief, which is by definition non-scientific. Here is where the science side gets things wrong. Creationism is a NON-scientific belief, not an ANTI-scientific belief. It's not anti-intellectual or stupid or backward either. It's a choice to believe in the sup…

>But there is no requirement that everyone on Earth only accept things based on empirical evidence.

You'd get laughed out of the left wing political sphere if you went around saying that.

Re: Texas Public Schools Are Teaching Creationism

#99

Post by vezzy-fnord »

mschuster91 wrote: post #52
freehunter wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every study I've seen contradicts this common sense argument. Combined with the fact that home schooled students still must take and pass state standardized tests means the students have to be at least meeting the minimum educational requirements. I have a family member in Texas with a home schooled child. They attend group teaching sessions, sit in on other classes, and use the many reference books that are provided…

Ah, so there indeed are required standards for home schooling? I did not know that. What are the consequences of not meeting these standards?

"Ah, so I'm calling for the ban of something I have no idea about."

Yep, not much better than the stereotypical conservative politician in that regard.

Re: Texas Public Schools Are Teaching Creationism

#100

Post by stephenhuey »

fnordfnordfnord wrote: post #72
FrankenPC wrote: post #29

How does one "teach" creationism? Answer: you don't. Simply reciting "god did it" over and over is sufficient. No, this is Christian apologetics that they are teaching. In other words it's a religion class, NOT a science class. If this school is taking public money, those funds need to be withdrawn until the curriculum is properly labeled.

As an Atheist, I am not generally opposed to a religion class, even a compulsory one. Religion is a reality, and ignoring it is as bad as ignoring any other reality. Teaching creationism is worse than a mere study of religion because it promotes rote memorization of demonstrably incorrect ideas as facts.

A fellow Christian and scientist named Dr. James Tour explained that many creationists do not understand the limits of the scientific method. Dr. Tour concludes, "I am sympathetic to the arguments on the matter and I find some of them intriguing, but the scientific proof is not there, in my opinion."

http://www.jmtour.com/personal-topics/the-scientist-and-his-...

So in response to people clamoring for creationism in the classroom, he suggests this:

"So what should be taught in schools regarding evolution? As I wrote, I am not a proponent of Intelligent Design for the reasons I state above: I can not prove it using my tools of chemistry to which I am bound in the chemistry classroom; the same tools to which I commensurately bind my evolutionist colleagues. But I think that a better approach might include more teaching about evolution, namely coverage of legitimate scientific criticisms of neo-Darwinism and disputes about the origin of the first life. That would be more balanced."

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