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CyanogenMod Installer Application Removed from Play Store

cyanogenmod.org

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Re: CyanogenMod Installer Application Removed from Play Store

#121

Post by Dan_Nguyen »

jMyles wrote: post #13
interpol_p wrote: post #8

While I view this move as hypocritical of Google, it does feel like it's in their customers' best interest. Think about it from a less technical perspective: I can install an app from the official Google Play store that voids my warranty . They can't have that on their public facing store. Google wants users to install apps, they don't want them to be afraid of voiding their warranty. It's interesting to see how thin…

Eh, it's actually a pretty weak argument. It doesn't violate your warranty on a nexus device. If google believes in the nexus program, then this is not a particularly consistent position.

The Nexus lines are not the only Android devices out there. Google has a huge interest in the rest of the Android lines and wouldn't want to piss off OEMs by including an app that would void their warranties.

I definitely agree with what that one Reddit comment says - if you can't sideload it then you shouldn't flash your ROM.

Re: CyanogenMod Installer Application Removed from Play Store

#122

Post by victorhooi »

fnordfnordfnord wrote: post #101
haberman wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> that you cant install without voiding warranties So you think that a user should be able install an OS that bricks their phone and still have the phone still covered by warranty? How does that make sense? Is this people's expectation of Google, that if they don't give you whatever you want (at their own expense) then they are like 90s Microsoft?

Any user action that is completely reversible, like installing software, should not render the warranty void.

Hi,

Yes - but why don't you think what you said through a bit...

I flash my motherboard with a custom BIOS image I've hex-edited together.

Now, it won't boot correctly.

Yes, it's reversible - I can probably figure out a way to flash the original image back on.

However, the motherboard manufacturer is hardly going to tolerate me taking it back going, you need to fix this. That's hardly reasonable.

They're going to be...err...you did something stupid and unsupported. You fix it. They might give me advice, but the onus is certainly not on them.

Or say I flash my car's ECU to give me another 5 HP of output. Then my car stops starting up reliably. I can't exactly take it back to Honda and say, fix it. They'll be like, we sold you a working car - you did something out of spec, and overrode the ECU software - we aren't fixing it.

Yes, it's reversible - I can flash the right ECU image back on and it will start up correctly - but the onus isn't on them to hand hold me through that process.

Cheers, Victor

Re: CyanogenMod Installer Application Removed from Play Store

#123

Post by victorhooi »

shooper wrote: post #115
naner wrote: post #28

With the CM Installer in the play store many lay-people started using it, rendering their phones unusable[1] when any little issue cropped up. Also the process wasn't foolproof even for people capable of dealing with technical issues[2]. It isn't polished enough to go in the play store IMO. I don't know WTF the cyanogenmod team was thinking, non-technical people messing with CM will just lead to negative press. 1: ht…

There is plenty of such software on the Play Store. E.g. Rom managers such as this one. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.koushikdut... > I don't know WTF the cyanogenmod team was thinking, non-technical people messing with CM will just lead to negative press. I know atleast three people who tried to install Linux and formatted their Windows partition in the process. So you mean Linux CDs and DVDs sho…

That's a terrible analogy.

Firstly, a PC != mobile phone.

This isn't a bloody OpenMoko phone - this is a working consumer device that's sold to you as a "dumb" device. It's like buying a television or DVD player, flashing some weird third-party firmware, then taking it back and saying, gee, it just stopped working...

Or flashing your car's ECU chip.

The manufacturer is certainly not expected to fix your mistake. They might for goodwill, but they have no obligation to.

Yes, there is certainly a danger in the proverbial grandma flashing her phone (why do we always pick on grandma's? I mean, geez, Hopper Grace was a grandma wasn't she? Lol).

I've seen countless phones soft-bricked by bad flashes. It's like upgrading your BIOS - if you get unlucky, or the power goes, you're SOL.

Google's just being responsible. The whole point of Android is that you can sideload ADB's easily.

Think of it as a entry test - if you can't load a non-PlayStore ADB onto your handset, you have absolutely no business installing a custom ROM.

Put it this way - you ask me how to flash your car's ECU.

I say, well, firstly, you need to pop open the bonnet and read me some numbers. And then you said to me, "Gee, how do I do that? I've never popped a bonnet open".

My next thought would probably be, "Err, are you really sure you want to flash your car's ECU?".

Cheers, Victor

Re: CyanogenMod Installer Application Removed from Play Store

#124

Post by victorhooi »

drcube wrote: post #114
thezilch wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No installation freedoms were lost; you can still install the software from the article or the secondary software installed by the article's software. No ownership freedoms were lost -- whatever that has to do with the article. Seriously.

You can install what you want -- maybe, if your carrier lets you or you find an exploit to root your non-Nexus phone -- on Android only. That's not the case with iPhones or Windows phones. And yes, this is worse (read: less freedom) than you got with a Windows machine in the 90s.

No, you can just sideload the ADB from outside the Android Market.

That's a pretty basic task for any Android user. In fact, if you can't do that, then you probably have no business whatsoever installing a customer ROM.

Think of it as a basic intelligence test - you want to change your car's air filter - first step is to pop open the bonnet. If you can't do that, then you probably want to seriously consider, gee, should I just get a mechanic to do this?

Re: CyanogenMod Installer Application Removed from Play Store

#125

Post by victorhooi »

Someone wrote: post #87
niels_olson wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I download instructions to hotrod my lawnmower, and then engine block cracks when the head gasket blows out, should I blame Toro for not locking down my lawnmower?

But in this case Toro used to host those instructions on its website.

But should they be?

Say there's a Toro site for add-ins (flashing lights or whatever, I have no idea how you'd mod a mower...lol).

And some of those add-ins will void your mower, and potentially break your machine. It's certainly within their prerogative to say "We won't host them. But you can just go to and get it from them instead". In fact, doesn't Google make a search engine? Surely, it's not hard to just Google for Cyanogenmod and find their hompage? In fact, if you can't do that, then probably shouldn't be flashing a ROM...

Re: CyanogenMod Installer Application Removed from Play Store

#126

Post by 37prime »

I have just download CyanogenMod Installer from Google Play Store and still have it in my now Android KitKat-running Nexus 4.

I intended to install CyanogenMod 10.1.3 which is based on Android Jelly Bean 4.2.2, on my nexus 4. I have not done so.

---

I also have the intention to install the stock Android Jelly Bean 4.3 on the same nexus 4; downgrading from Android KitKat 4.4.

I found that Android KitKat on Nexus 4 (and Nexus 5) now redirect tethering network traffic to the carrier login page, specifically T-Mobile USA. Strangely, I had no problems using the built-in tethering (Nexus 4 - Andorid KitKat combo) with AT&T network.

Re: CyanogenMod Installer Application Removed from Play Store

#127

Post by yongjik »

ars_technician wrote: post #93
haberman wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's recap. Prior to today, a community-developed fork of Google's open-source operating system could be installed by using an app from Google's own app store (which sometimes bricked the phone). After today, a community-developed fork of Google's open-source operating system can be installed by downloading the installer from the CM website. This somehow makes Google like 90's Microsoft? How many operating systems o…

>If you want to see a real socialist No true Scotsman is a logical fallacy that you should avoid. Saying there is someone out there that is worse actually does nothing to address the original point. Let me demonstrate, "You think Romney was conservative? Look at X tea party member that wants to own slaves." Do you see how that doesn't do anything to refute that Romney is conservative?

Dude, calling Obama a socialist is not comparable to calling Romney conservative. It's more like calling Romney gay.

Oh, you say he isn't gay? No true homosexual Scotsman, it seems.

Re: CyanogenMod Installer Application Removed from Play Store

#128

Post by [deleted] »

yongjik wrote: post #127
ars_technician wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>If you want to see a real socialist No true Scotsman is a logical fallacy that you should avoid. Saying there is someone out there that is worse actually does nothing to address the original point. Let me demonstrate, "You think Romney was conservative? Look at X tea party member that wants to own slaves." Do you see how that doesn't do anything to refute that Romney is conservative?

Dude, calling Obama a socialist is not comparable to calling Romney conservative. It's more like calling Romney gay. Oh, you say he isn't gay? No true homosexual Scotsman, it seems.

[deleted]

Re: CyanogenMod Installer Application Removed from Play Store

#129

Post by crdoconnor »

haberman wrote: post #56
gcb1 wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

let me see... google and the open handset aliance advertise an open source OS, that you cant install without voiding warranties and bending to proprietary radio and firmware code. just like pc manufacturers of the 80/90s (bios was reverse engineered from IBM and then tightly controled by ami. it only looked slighly open because IBM was much more closed. same with android standing next to apple.

> that you cant install without voiding warranties So you think that a user should be able install an OS that bricks their phone and still have the phone still covered by warranty? How does that make sense? Is this people's expectation of Google, that if they don't give you whatever you want (at their own expense) then they are like 90s Microsoft?

>So you think that a user should be able install an OS that bricks their phone and still have the phone still covered by warranty? > >How does that make sense?

Because software shouldn't brick the phone. It should ALWAYS be possible to download and restore the pre-installed operating system and factory settings (it definitely was on my last android phone - an xperia - which I 'bricked' multiple times trying to get cyanogen to work).

This really does remind me of the bundle/don't bundle internet explorer wars. "Oh, but you can just download netscape if you really want it!"

Re: CyanogenMod Installer Application Removed from Play Store

#130

Post by sushirain »

A better compromise would have been to just enforce a modal warning message in the play store, such as:

"Warning! This app can brick your device. Google is not responsible for its damages, and you may loose other warranties, too!"

Regarding kids, that would overlook the warning, they still have to download the PC software. So the procedure isn't significantly more simplified than going directly to the website.

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