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ElementaryOs Luna released

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Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#261
post #255
post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a matter of fact, I wrote that very program, Switchboard. It's getting late and I don't want to write a whole book about it's design (though I could), but basically here's the story: I saw some mockups Daniel Fore (the project's founder and lead designer) created for a hypothetical system settings app. Here's an example: http://danrabbit.deviantart.com/art/User-Accounts-Plug-19860... I set about coding the app. I…

> Do I change the settings app JUST to look different than OS X, and lose out on the well-established excellence of Apple's design? I want to single that statement out and go on from there. I'm a bit hesitant to write this comment because, well, I'm about to criticize you and Apple, and at least the latter tends to invite downvotes and a not so nice discussion. But I think it is important to try to get that message a…

> Take the global menu Ubuntu copied. It sacrifices visibility and therefore discoverability of the menu items for visual appeal.

I think you are missing some context.

Early Apple experiments in GUI design initially used multiple menu bars anchored to the tops of windows, but this was quickly dropped in favor of the current arrangement,[1] as it proved slower to use (in accordance with Fitts's law). The idea of separate menus in each application was later implemented in Microsoft Windows and is the default representation in most Linux desktop environments.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Menu_bar

This was in 1983, when Tognazzini was working on the Lisa, inventing some of the UI concepts we still use and very carefully considering efficiency when choosing them. You may disagree with him—his stance that the mouse is faster than a command line shell is widely controversial—but visual appeal was not nearly his main concern.

Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#262
post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a matter of fact, I wrote that very program, Switchboard. It's getting late and I don't want to write a whole book about it's design (though I could), but basically here's the story: I saw some mockups Daniel Fore (the project's founder and lead designer) created for a hypothetical system settings app. Here's an example: http://danrabbit.deviantart.com/art/User-Accounts-Plug-19860... I set about coding the app. I…

Let's see if I have that right: * The designer did it, not me! * I argued with him for months and ended up saying "ah, screw it". * Ubuntu and Gnome do it too! I don't see any of these as exculpatory. Not that what you've done is necessarily wrong per se , I'd just rather you come by it honestly. I don't think any of these designs (or for example some of the icons - or even the decision to group elements into these c…

This is one thing that frustrates me about Hacker News, and why I am considering just not bothering with this site in the future. Anytime I am honest about my reactions to stuff, along come the downvoters. You cannot justifiably call people on bullshit, vacuousness, "buck-passing", intellectual laziness, or anything like that. You just have to let everybody else's bullshit slide, or pad your criticism with passive aggressive nonsense and pats on the back ("good job, brah"), and sing kumbaya and talk about javascript and entrepreneurship or whatever bullshit.

What kind of "hacker" community does not allow room for the occasional independent thought expressed with a hint of abrasiveness? I welcome downvotes from passive aggressive screwballs on this site. They are a badge of honor.

Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for the reply! :) I will definitely give it a whirl. I have been playing around with the rasp Pi and given that your OS is approx 200MB, I wanna try seeing if I can make the two work together(or if someone else has, do let me know). Good job btw!

"~200 MB less than Ubuntu's" , not 200 MB. It is over 700 MB.

Whoops, I misread. Well, still doesnt mean cant try it :P

Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#264
post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a certain downside to mimicking the OS X design that you may not be taken full account of, which is that for people who have used OS X, your designs look like a not-quite-perfected copy. It's a sort of uncanny valley thing that manifests itself likewise in the common discussion of whether something feels "native", or whether you should use the OS-provided UI elements vs. re-invent the wheel when writing an ap…

I appreciate the input. All I can really say is that you have to remember elementary is not a business. We don't have investors. We don't aim for market share or target X number of users by X date. Fundamentally, we build what we think is best, and if other people find it valuable too, they use it. So far, it's worked. So "user acquisition" isn't really a concern for us, though frankly, I believe it should be. And un…

It looks intriguing, and I can't wait to try it out. Thanks for your hard work.

Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#266
I haven't used a Mac since a bit after the introduction of quadro or whatever it was, so I don't have a dog in most of the discussion above. I also don't own a mobile device. Those facts probably date me as a Linux user.

Here's a suggestion for designers: the age of the Linux user base is aging at a rate of one year per year. That doesn't mean there are no young ones, only that we are going where no Linux user has gone before (I joined various Linux projects back in 1992.)

Every human on earth, after there mid 40s, experiences changes in the geometric optics of their vision system. As my eye doctor says, the denial rate is 100% and the participation rate is 100% -- if you are lucky enough to reach that age.

Please design an accessible operating system we can still use in our 80s. This is a very big opportunity. How old will you be in 2038 is maybe a good design target. ;)

Accessible on a mobile device, a desktop, and able to function smoothly with presbyteropia is the basic design spec.

Get your team an old geek geezer or two to tell what works and what doesn't. When I forget my reading glasses at work, I have to use the Magnify app on Win7. Go ahead and try this, and see what the experience is like and if it's so perfect it can't be improved on you are done. Otherwise, work on that aspect of your design.

Even if you are young and not 'there' yet, try out the Magnify app, and try whatever Linux has to offer on your distro of choice for the same thing. It completely changes how you size windows and operated effectively. It will give you insight into important principles of design such as navigating windows, scrolling, keyboard usage, etc.

There is no need to make the very best of what exists today -- make the very best that will be needed tomorrow.

You will appreciate this advice one day.

Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#267

Mark my words: elementary OS is going to be big. I was on a beta version of elementary OS a couple months ago, and it was like a breath of fresh air. elementary OS sets out to settle the number one complaint casual users have of other Linux distributions: design. Other Linux distributions look like a mish-mash of a bunch of different designs by many different people. elementary OS has a beautiful, striking, and (most…

It's interesting that the features of this OS sound like the features of Gnome in the late 90s (we care about design, and we don't swamp the user with choices)... and Ubuntu a few years later. I truly wish this project the best but it will be an uphill battle when Apple revamps the look of OS X, and Elementary OS is left looking like a dated, less consistent version of someone else's system software. That sounds more…

You can still describe Ubuntu and GNOME as "we care about design, and we don't swamp the user with choices."

Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'd never install a non-apt system? You should try a pacman based system, I find it to be nicer, because it embodies the Arch philosophy of keeping things simple.

So simple it didn't even have package signing until a year or two ago. No thanks.

And ... ?

It currently has package signing, right? What's the problem? I'm confused at how a historical problem that has been fixed even matters when discussing why or why not to use it. It's like saying you wouldn't use OS X because 10.1 didn't support Intel processors.

Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Open dconf-editor, navigate to (I think, if I'm wrong, just look around) org.pantheon.terminal and change the opacity field to 100.

Yes, that worked fine. But I had to install the dconf-editor package first, then invoke dconf-editor from the terminal. Booted my ancient workstation (quad Xeon, nvidia GT520 graphics card) and had the usual issue with 'composited' dekstops and nouveau - very slow screen refresh. This is not a LunaOS specific problem, it happens with Gnome Shell based distributions. (Ubuntu 12.04 drops down to the Unity 2d shell whic…

Weird that you had to invoke it from the terminal. It should have been added to the applications menu.

Re: ElementaryOs Luna released

#270
post #258
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see. And how do your holiness save your "less-than-technical friends and family" from Google, Gmail, iTunes, YouTube, Facebook....

Wow, such vitriol. Let me guess, you're a big Ubuntu fan, and my assertion about privacy offended you and your clan. Now you're trying to peg me as some sort of moral absolutist. Well, I'm not, I just do what I can do when it comes to getting people to use software that respect their privacy. Obviously, people make their own decisions. Sometimes they ask recommendations, and I respond with my honest opinion. So when…

I'm the exact opposite of a big Ubuntu fan (I was, but after the switch to Unity everything started being slow, and Canonical started getting weird, and I realized I didn't really like the community behind it, but those are all tangential points), and I agree with him/her/whatever. Making the claim that you're saving them from "the evils of Amazon and Canonical", while not doing the same for other things that are worse offenders than Ubuntu is rather hypocritical.

Your first comment implied that you're moral absolutist on this front.

Okay, you might be suggesting that they not use those other things, but your attempt to debase the previous comment on the grounds that they might like Ubuntu is silly and worthless.

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