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U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

computerworld.com

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Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#61

Post by rhizome »

Zigurd wrote: post #7
artichokeheart wrote: post #3

"The level of skepticism was greater than I expected," said Jim Reavis, co-founder and executive director of the CSA. "I had thought that more people would understand that these activities happen all the time in their countries as well." Way to not get the point Mr Reavis

That quote is just astounding. The "Cloud Security Association?" Really? It reflects a strange kind of toadyism that some "security professionals" have about cooperating with intelligence and law enforcement.

They work hard to track how little security the cloud has.

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#62

Post by perlpimp »

j-g-faustus wrote: post #35
deegles wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honest question, what makes you think that you will have more rights/privacy by hosting somewhere else? It's been my impression that there has been (comparatively) little backlash within the US regarding foreign data acquisition. Maybe all this attention on the NSA's activities will be the trigger for other countries to create or ramp-up their own data snooping efforts.

Two reasons for non-Americans: - the snooping is explicitly targeting foreigners. In USA I'm a foreigner, by hosting in my own country I have at least the protection of being a citizen. - if I don't like the snooping my own government does, I can call my representatives, vote for "less snooping" political candidates, start lobbying etc. In a foreign country like USA I have no rights or leverage whatsoever.

NSA and CIA has been used for Industrial espionage purposes in the past, so I wouldn't be surprised if this whole PRISM program was in part for enriching the wealthy and connected even more (and their enterprises).

We already moved our servers & data back to Germany right now evaluating few replacements for Google Apps.

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#64

Post by tippytop »

beloch wrote: post #18

After SOPA, it became clear that the U.S. info sector could no longer neglect its lobbying efforts in Washington. The MPAA and RIAA represent comparatively tiny (in terms of revenue) interests but were only thwarted by the unpredictable (and unreliable) intervention of the public. Now this. The info sector has become big industry and is going to play a correspondingly big role in U.S. politics going forward. They're…

Be careful what you wish for, Google is now one of the biggest spenders in Washington [1], $18.2 million on lobbying in 2012. Needless to say, big business in the tech sector will have plenty of say in the future (if that was ever a worry), but, as always, civil liberties will continually need to be fought for.

[1] http://www.theverge.com/2013/6/4/4394234/google-eight-bigges...

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#65

Post by ascendant2323 »

flyt wrote: post #9

Pretty simple way to frame this in a way that Washington can understand: The NSA data collection programs are _job killers_ for American high-tech workers and its most innovative companies.

Hear hear. It hurts the _job creators_, the only people who matter!

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#66

Post by velik_m »

The biggest danger to the USA tech industry isn't even the customer blowback, which might blow over soon enough. The biggest danger is an opportunity for local competition to lobby the local governments to legitimately regulate US competition out of the market. For instance if the German government demands that all operating systems have to be open source (to prevent backdors) and replaces Windows with something like LiMux (which will of course be serviced by local companies who lobbied) and all companies dealing with citizen data have to use it as well, Microsoft could lose a huge chunk of market almost over night.

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#67

Post by teeja »

dcc1 wrote: post #21

Ive one server left in US, cancelling it soon, thats 900/month less going into US economy.

Good for you. Thoroughly understandable, that money could help to build infrastructure in your own country. At the same time, the economic cost will undoubtedly help to end this undemocratic insanity, and will make these guys far more sensitive to their endless xenophobia.

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#68

Post by papaf »

computer wrote: post #15

I too have switched my personal things and most of our company away from the US. I have helped my friends move to non-US chat services and/or use OTR. I will spend my money on secure (from snooping and the operator) encrypted services outside the US instead. Seeing that we have no rights in the US whatsoever, it is ridiculous to store anything in the United States that could be used in any way at any point in the fut…

I don't think that you need to bring countries into this.

Ubiquitous surveillance goes hand in hand with corruption and authoritarianism. Cloud services make surveillance easier - get off the cloud and run your own services.

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#69

Post by bowlofpetunias »

beloch wrote: post #18

After SOPA, it became clear that the U.S. info sector could no longer neglect its lobbying efforts in Washington. The MPAA and RIAA represent comparatively tiny (in terms of revenue) interests but were only thwarted by the unpredictable (and unreliable) intervention of the public. Now this. The info sector has become big industry and is going to play a correspondingly big role in U.S. politics going forward. They're…

You're forgetting that the same industry is already getting the US government to lean on non-US governments to relax their privacy laws so that the US info sector can perpetrate it's own massive privacy violations thing for fun and profit.

As far as non-US citizens and their privacy is concerned, the US tech industry and the NSA are just two sides of the same coin.

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#70

Post by bowlofpetunias »

tippytop wrote: post #64
beloch wrote: post #18

After SOPA, it became clear that the U.S. info sector could no longer neglect its lobbying efforts in Washington. The MPAA and RIAA represent comparatively tiny (in terms of revenue) interests but were only thwarted by the unpredictable (and unreliable) intervention of the public. Now this. The info sector has become big industry and is going to play a correspondingly big role in U.S. politics going forward. They're…

Be careful what you wish for, Google is now one of the biggest spenders in Washington [1], $18.2 million on lobbying in 2012. Needless to say, big business in the tech sector will have plenty of say in the future (if that was ever a worry), but, as always, civil liberties will continually need to be fought for. [1] http://www.theverge.com/2013/6/4/4394234/google-eight-bigges...

And what does Google lobby for? Amongst other things, getting the EU to relax it's privacy protections.

Yeah, those are really the guys I want on my side when it comes to fighting for civil liberties...

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