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U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

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Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#51
As of yesterday I've been noticing various Google applications (Maps in particular, both web and iOS) nagging me to turn on centralised history recording, in order to have any kind of search history or bookmarking.

My answer is "hell no", always has been and even more so now; and I can deal with the disappearance of functionality, but the nagging is especially irritating and the timing doubly ironic.

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the EFF really strapped for cash? If their budget was 2 or 3 times bigger, would they really be able to do a lot more?

Unlikely. And I believe that the issue is that some politicians still have an old school boy mentality where nerds/geeks are somehow lesser than them. Rep. Jason Chaffetz (R-Utah) famously said "Bring in the Nerds" during SOPA hearings. He then continued to call people in technology nerds multiple times. Youtube link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xrrj9Wc2L84 Rep. Mel Watts (D-NC) made it a point in his opening stat…

Until congress starts to realize that nerds are not basement dwellers, and instead are pop culture (Facebook, The Internship) they will continue to roll their eyes at any sort of lobbying.

Good. That creates an opportunity for more enlightened people to challenge the incumbents, backed by the ample funding that the nerds are going to be throwing around increasingly in order to protect their industry from the incompetents.

A saying that begins "First they ignore you" comes to mind.

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#53
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Off-topic, but a fun way to take this to the next level: if you have your own domain, you can set mx records with the same priority at different services to randomly scatter your incoming mail. You can then pull them in with pop3 with your mail client or getmail with something like Dovecot to provide a self-hosted IMAP interface. You get the added benefit of having automatic fallbacks if one of your mail services is…

Would you really get a random distribution if MX records all had the same priority? Sounds like a fun test & experiment.

You should (in theory, at least).

I can't speak for all DNS servers but BIND will return them in a different order each time it answers an query.

For example, the first query returns "mx1, mx2, mx3"; next query returns "mx2, mx3, ms1"; next query returns "mx3, mx1, mx2". Many resolvers seem to simply use the first one so it's roughly equivalent to round robin load balancing.

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#54
post #28

This is why in my recent rant about how Microsoft could re-establish its relevance [1], one recommendation was that Microsoft differentiate itself as the only tech titan to champion a decentralized cloud. I fairly strongly feel that would be a competitive advantage. (Of course if all self-managed security implemented on Microsoft operating systems can be subverted by the NSA, it's a moot point.) [1] http://tiamat.tso…

ha.. Talk about doing the right thing at the wrong time and wrong thing at the right time. Microsoft is pushing hard to move everything to the cloud. Office, Search, Storage - Skydrive, pretty much your entire desktop by the middle of this decade. Had they stayed put, they could have had a easy bright future.

Rule #1: Never follow your competitor in pitch dark.

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#55
post #28

This is why in my recent rant about how Microsoft could re-establish its relevance [1], one recommendation was that Microsoft differentiate itself as the only tech titan to champion a decentralized cloud. I fairly strongly feel that would be a competitive advantage. (Of course if all self-managed security implemented on Microsoft operating systems can be subverted by the NSA, it's a moot point.) [1] http://tiamat.tso…

Microsoft has such a good relationship with the government that its unlikely to be able to extricate itself to every accomplish that.

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't the NSA spy on foreign operations without any legal oversight, as opposed to spying on domestic operations with "oversight" from a secret court? Both are bad.

> Can't the NSA spy on foreign operations without any legal oversight Yeah. It would be kind of bizarre to have a military signals intelligence service where spying on foreign electronic communications was some kind of exceptional activity. The whole point of the NSA is spying on foreign operations. The legal restrictions involving a "secret court" (the two courts themselves aren't secret, though their proceedings te…

Yeah. It would be kind of bizarre to have a military signals intelligence service where spying on foreign electronic communications was some kind of exceptional activity.

And then international travel became a routine occurrence, and countries made "alliances", and international commerce became one of the most powerful forces driving the global economy, and the Internet arrived, and the kind of black and white world you're imagining went away. No country exists in such a vacuum in the twenty-first century, and a country that respects the basic rights of its own people but completely ignores the rights of others will pay a price for that hostility sooner or later. At least today that price is mostly measured in dollars and not blood as it might have been a few decades ago.

It's sad that a lot of the abuses we've seen and heard about in recent years have to be curtailed through financial pressure and not politicians doing the right thing, but that doesn't make people voting with their wallets any less effective.

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unlikely. And I believe that the issue is that some politicians still have an old school boy mentality where nerds/geeks are somehow lesser than them. Rep. Jason Chaffetz (R-Utah) famously said "Bring in the Nerds" during SOPA hearings. He then continued to call people in technology nerds multiple times. Youtube link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xrrj9Wc2L84 Rep. Mel Watts (D-NC) made it a point in his opening stat…

Until congress starts to realize that nerds are not basement dwellers, and instead are pop culture (Facebook, The Internship) they will continue to roll their eyes at any sort of lobbying. Good. That creates an opportunity for more enlightened people to challenge the incumbents, backed by the ample funding that the nerds are going to be throwing around increasingly in order to protect their industry from the incompet…

That seems like wishful thinking. Nerds don't run for office. They're not interested and mostly busy doing other stuff. Spending Valley lobby dollars might buy our industry a timeshare in a politician, but "our" rep won't have any more respect for nerds than anybody else in Washington.

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#58
post #18

After SOPA, it became clear that the U.S. info sector could no longer neglect its lobbying efforts in Washington. The MPAA and RIAA represent comparatively tiny (in terms of revenue) interests but were only thwarted by the unpredictable (and unreliable) intervention of the public. Now this. The info sector has become big industry and is going to play a correspondingly big role in U.S. politics going forward. They're…

The depressing thing here is that it is going to a wrong direction. Instead of working to reduce the intervention of the politicians in the private affairs, what would inevitably happen is more money spent on lobbying, more laws bought by these money and more politicians and and government functionaries having their services to offer for sale. Instead of government getting smaller, the government will get bigger - and this would be paid by exactly the businesses who suffered from the expansion of the government. They just will pay so the other guys would suffer instead of them, now that they have enough money to play the game.

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#59
post #12
post #9

Pretty simple way to frame this in a way that Washington can understand: The NSA data collection programs are _job killers_ for American high-tech workers and its most innovative companies.

"Hard working, innovative technology companies are losing out to foreign companies due to this unaccountable, big government program. It's time to reign in this anticompetitive NSA behavior and let American business compete on a level playing field." *formatted for a talking head to use on FOX News/MSNBC/CNN

"Those companies are full of hipster kids with fancy Ivy League degrees, spoiled with perks and massive salaries, making useless products that are scary because your kids understand them and you don't. They're coldly taking steady jobs in manufacturing, retail, and service just so Google can install another ball bit.

The NSA has put them in their place and now they're whining. And don't forget, these programs keep you safe."

People will believe whatever spin fits better with their pre-existing point of view.

Re: U.S. cloud firms face backlash from NSA spy programs

#60
post #55
post #28

This is why in my recent rant about how Microsoft could re-establish its relevance [1], one recommendation was that Microsoft differentiate itself as the only tech titan to champion a decentralized cloud. I fairly strongly feel that would be a competitive advantage. (Of course if all self-managed security implemented on Microsoft operating systems can be subverted by the NSA, it's a moot point.) [1] http://tiamat.tso…

Microsoft has such a good relationship with the government that its unlikely to be able to extricate itself to every accomplish that.

But doesn't Microsoft also have good relationship with other governments? Wouldn't that make them play diplomatic? If Microsoft is found inserting backdoors into their core OS, every other government using their product would dump it for something else. From a business perspective why would someone willingly take that risk?
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