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Life for a startup on the receiving end of a patent law suit

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Re: Life for a startup on the receiving end of a patent law suit

#61
post #37
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well in general (and not specific to this situation) one of the effective ways you can deal with someone like this is to waste as much of their time as possible in whatever way can. The person on the phone has to have a certain amount of productivity and while they are not going to drop their claim against you if you become a nice pain in the ass they will have the motivation to work with you. If you are quick and ea…

but aren't you wasting your time too, while wasting theirs? for them, it is a full time job (so they might not care), but for the people who have to deal with them, it isn't

Well you would have to calculate the value of your time vs. either a) cost of attorneys (whose time is very expensive and it's a black box of costs) b) other things that you do that could be offloaded to someone else or perhaps c) putting someone of less value in charge of wasting of time.

We are not talking about hours and hours all at once either. We are talking about being a constant time waster and pain in the ass a little bit at a time or as much as possible while still flying under the radar and appearing not to be doing it on purpose (which you are).

At a certain point people will act in their self interest and perhaps give you what you want. At least that has been my experience when I've followed this path.

Re: Life for a startup on the receiving end of a patent law suit

#66

As much as patent trolls are an enormous problem, they are not the only villains in this story. The others are of course the lawyers and the courts. Let's say that you received a summons in the mail informing you that your startup was being sued. First of all, why are you receiving it in the mail? Why can't the Secretary of State ask for your e-mail address (as some do) and actually use it for service of process? (An…

> That would require you to have a PACER account, which costs money beyond $15.00 per quarter in fake-page access at $0.10 per fake-page

Patent law is federal law, and nearly all the relevant federal opinions are available for free online. I do think it is problematic, in principle, that very small corporations cannot represent themselves pro-se. That said, pro-se litigants are an enormous burden on courts because they have no idea what they're doing. A federal judge will have hundreds of cases on her plate at any given time. They need litigants to get in, make their case, and get out.

> But what does lawyering really involve? Copying and pasting from Microsoft Word templates, turning Word files into PDFs, attesting to obvious things ("I have caused this envelope to be placed in the mail as of this date") and occasionally reading a similar case to cite.

My mom thinks that programming just involves "typing things into the computer." What you're describing is paralegals' work if not secretarial work. Most of lawyer's work involves researching case law, writing memos and briefs, doing factual investigation, interviewing witnesses, taking depositions, etc. Clients are sophisticated. They're not paying $500/hour lawyers to turn Word documents into PDF's, not when you can get droves of bar-admitted lawyers to work for $20/hour on Craigslist.

> Because the courts won't let computers into the picture.

Invent a computer program that can apply the law to the specific facts of a case and generate a helpful brief and we'll talk. In reality, many college and law-school educated people of well above average intelligence can't write a helpful brief.

The legal industry has been adopting computer technology as it becomes available. A good example is document review. Computers excel at searching through large amounts of information looking for potentially-relevant documents, so law firms increasingly use computers to flag such documents (though many/most clients still prefer to have this outsourced to low-cost contract attorneys). Most work that used to be done by secretaries is automated. Document management systems produce blacklines, track changes is used to enter revisions, etc. Again, clients are sophisticated. They're not paying $500/hour for a lawyer to manually enter hand-markups.

Re: Life for a startup on the receiving end of a patent law suit

#67
post #36

Would it be safe to move the company outside of US where patent troll cannot reach in legal jurisdiction?

You can move the company. But as long as you make sales in US, you can be blocked from doing business.

How would they exactly block you from doing business? Unless you have a physical presence, if all your transcations take place online, how would it be different from doing in the US and outside?

Re: Life for a startup on the receiving end of a patent law suit

#68
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can move the company. But as long as you make sales in US, you can be blocked from doing business.

How would they exactly block you from doing business? Unless you have a physical presence, if all your transcations take place online, how would it be different from doing in the US and outside?

Court order will prohibit the sales. The decision will be delivered to whatever representatives the company has on US soil, as well as to customs, payment processors and whatnot.

Re: Life for a startup on the receiving end of a patent law suit

#69
post #52
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Too easy to game. With the minimum legal cost of a successful defense being $200,000, what kind of monthly rate would cover that?

Google, Twitter, Yahoo and Facebook need to make this insurance happen. They all want to help erase software patent abuse anyway, right? Are they serious about it? If so, they could put together this insurance at reasonable/subsidized rates for startups, and immediately get the opportunity to fight 90%+ of all patent troll cases relevant to their interests.

Google, Twitter, Yahoo and Facebook all hold patents which will make you go "wat. that is patentable?". They aren't nice guys. And all of them (except for yahoo) are holding de-facto monopolies.

Re: Life for a startup on the receiving end of a patent law suit

#70
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can move the company. But as long as you make sales in US, you can be blocked from doing business.

How would they exactly block you from doing business? Unless you have a physical presence, if all your transcations take place online, how would it be different from doing in the US and outside?

Customs will seize your domain name without warning or following any particular legal process. https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2012/08/members-congress-deman...
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