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Angry young Indians: What a waste

economist.com

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Re: Angry young Indians: What a waste

#31

Post by chailatte »

f1vespeed wrote: post #20

As a US-raised Indian I'm not familiar with the macro details. But I've been living in India for the past few years working for a startup, so let me identify some low-hanging fruit. 1) Incredibly, shockingly poor hygiene. Dirty black rags being used repeatedly to dry plates at restaurants. Idlys being cooked on plastic sheets inside hot streamers. Infernoes of uncollected trash burning on streets. Rats and cockroache…

I am a huge pessimist about India. here's why.

1.) Everyone in the thread is ignoring a huge point raised by the author: this is the last biggest bubble we will ever witness in our lifetime (and possibly for many lifetimes) due to

a.) unpeg of gold standard

b.) shift from farm to factory work

c.) shift from one income to two income household

d.) machine/software advances

and many other factors has produced the greatest economic growth we have ever seen in history. However, due to

a.) unsustainable financial gambling

b.) wealth growth only in top 1%, mostly through rentier effects

c.) robots, automation and artificial intelligence resulting in jobs destruction

d.) population slowdown, shift to older demographics

the second dip in global economic depression is happening. and will induce so much deflation soon that 99% of the world population will be very very poor. for 3-4 generations.

2.) due to the lack of hygiene/lack of transportation/too many people/bad weather/trash everywhere/homeless everywhere/fecal matters on the streets/too many doctors prescribing antibiotics, resulting in super-resistant viruses, there will be a huge epidemic sooner or later that might wipe out millions of people, and nobody will be able to do anything about it because the crash in the economy.

3.) Growth in IT outsourcing is no more. Foreign investments are down big. There are better countries for companies to invest in that have better infrastructure and speaks better english.

Re: Angry young Indians: What a waste

#32

Post by at-fates-hands »

India reminds me a lot of what Taiwan used to be. About 10-15 years ago, they were a big joke when he came to cycle manufacturing. The quality of the bikes they produced and the factories there were horrible sweatshops.

Then, they started getting better. They updated their technology, they had better trained workers to run the new machines. Then bike manufacturers started to see what was going on, and started moving big chunks of their manufacturing over there. Last time I checked, companies like Giant, Trek, and Specialized all have some of their manufacturing over there now. Their factories are some of the most advanced manufacturing plants in the world.

I think India has the same potential, but its still about 3-5 years from realizing its own potential. It will be interesting to see if it can make the jump, or remain a great "what if. . " story line.

Re: Angry young Indians: What a waste

#33

Post by auctiontheory »

at-fates-hands wrote: post #32

India reminds me a lot of what Taiwan used to be. About 10-15 years ago, they were a big joke when he came to cycle manufacturing. The quality of the bikes they produced and the factories there were horrible sweatshops. Then, they started getting better. They updated their technology, they had better trained workers to run the new machines. Then bike manufacturers started to see what was going on, and started moving…

Education, infrastructure, and even basic literacy are at least an order of magnitude worse in India than in Taiwan.

Re: Angry young Indians: What a waste

#34

Post by rikacomet »

mayank wrote: post #29
rikacomet wrote: post #25

I did a research a while back. For an entrepreneur, there are only two things he can make broadly, products and services. While services is a another thing, new products depend on a major workforce of prototyping industry. Product Development in short is: Idea --> CAD File -- Prototype It appears, that most of the prototyping firms, do not pick up from in the middle, i.e, If I had a Idea, no firm was ready to produce…

Bottleneck, or opportunity?

bottleneck for those who don't have either money or skill to take this opportunity.

Re: Angry young Indians: What a waste

#35

Post by rikacomet »

mayank wrote: post #29
rikacomet wrote: post #25

I did a research a while back. For an entrepreneur, there are only two things he can make broadly, products and services. While services is a another thing, new products depend on a major workforce of prototyping industry. Product Development in short is: Idea --> CAD File -- Prototype It appears, that most of the prototyping firms, do not pick up from in the middle, i.e, If I had a Idea, no firm was ready to produce…

Bottleneck, or opportunity?

bottleneck for those who don't have either money or skill to take this opportunity.

Re: Angry young Indians: What a waste

#36

Post by lake99 »

intended wrote: post #27
lake99 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The burden of proof is on you; For what claims of mine? > People can't be fired Ha! I have seen people getting fired all the time! Did you mean blue-collar workers can't be fired? > I can corroborate everything ... With anecdotal evidence? > automatic entitlement to provident fund/pension plans We are entitled to that from the very first day of employment, if the company has more than a certain number of employees.…

You are entitled to a PF/pension if you are an employee of,a form. But if you are an employee of a labor firm which then sends you to Mahindra and Mahindra to work - you are not entitled to a pension from Mahindra. On top of that if you get fired after two years, you haven't worked long enough to be counted as an employee of the labor form or as a de facto employee of Mahindra. Hence no PF for you. This is the scam p…

> As for searching, try Wikipedia. It will get you to the labor laws in question and from there the laws of the land.

All I see is, "Wikipedia/Google. Therefore, I am right."

I know contract workers are not entitled to pensions from client firms. What relation does that have with the article I was commenting on, or my comments?

Look, your anecdotal evidence does not correlate with mine at all. I will add that the labour/owner dynamics vary a lot from state to state. Tamil Nadu, Kerala, UP, Rajasthan are all vastly different from each other. Absenteeism during festivals? I have heard of that in Kerala. Not in Karnataka, not in UP. Managers getting physically attacked? I have seen that in UP, seen threats in Karnataka, Andhra, not seen in Tamil Nadu. This is exactly why sound analysis based on sound data is important.

Re: Angry young Indians: What a waste

#37

Post by chailatte »

auctiontheory wrote: post #33
at-fates-hands wrote: post #32

India reminds me a lot of what Taiwan used to be. About 10-15 years ago, they were a big joke when he came to cycle manufacturing. The quality of the bikes they produced and the factories there were horrible sweatshops. Then, they started getting better. They updated their technology, they had better trained workers to run the new machines. Then bike manufacturers started to see what was going on, and started moving…

Education, infrastructure, and even basic literacy are at least an order of magnitude worse in India than in Taiwan.

taiwan also didn't also have the problem of

1.) large population

2.) squatters rights

3.) apathetic/spineless voters

4.) human fecal matters on the streets

5.) water shortage

6.) religious ferver

7.) entranched corruption

8.)....many more

Re: Angry young Indians: What a waste

#38

Post by vacri »

gyepi wrote: post #2

>The average age of cabinet ministers is 65. The country has never had a prime minister born in independent India. >One man who might buck that trend, Rahul Gandhi, is the son, >grandson and great-grandson of former prime ministers. >India is run by gerontocrats and epigones: grey hairs and groomed heirs. Aside from that wonderful turn of phrase, this may well be the key concept: India has long been run by entrenched…

This being said, it's unusual for a democratic head of government to be anything other than a grey-hair. Other movers and shakers, sure, but to climb to the very top in a democracy generally takes a while.

Re: Angry young Indians: What a waste

#39

Post by seanmcdirmid »

vacri wrote: post #38
gyepi wrote: post #2

>The average age of cabinet ministers is 65. The country has never had a prime minister born in independent India. >One man who might buck that trend, Rahul Gandhi, is the son, >grandson and great-grandson of former prime ministers. >India is run by gerontocrats and epigones: grey hairs and groomed heirs. Aside from that wonderful turn of phrase, this may well be the key concept: India has long been run by entrenched…

This being said, it's unusual for a democratic head of government to be anything other than a grey-hair. Other movers and shakers, sure, but to climb to the very top in a democracy generally takes a while.

I don't think this is true in Western democracies, where age can be a liability during an election. Advisers yes, but the guy running on the ticket needs to project charisma and vigor as well as some wisdom. The funny thing about elections: the electorate doesn't look at your CV so much; Obama was just a 1 term senator before he became president. Having more political experience would have actually been a liability for him as he would be seen as more of an insider.

This is definitely true in the directly elected presidential system we have in the states (definitely true post Clinton, even Reagan was an exception). Parliamentary systems are a bit different since the prime minister is elected indirectly, but even there we are seeing some fairly young heads of states in the UK and Germany (Cameron is 40 something, Merkell has been their 7 years and hasn't even hit 60 yet).

Re: Angry young Indians: What a waste

#40

Post by rodgerd »

vacri wrote: post #38
gyepi wrote: post #2

>The average age of cabinet ministers is 65. The country has never had a prime minister born in independent India. >One man who might buck that trend, Rahul Gandhi, is the son, >grandson and great-grandson of former prime ministers. >India is run by gerontocrats and epigones: grey hairs and groomed heirs. Aside from that wonderful turn of phrase, this may well be the key concept: India has long been run by entrenched…

This being said, it's unusual for a democratic head of government to be anything other than a grey-hair. Other movers and shakers, sure, but to climb to the very top in a democracy generally takes a while.

Perhaps New Zealand's an outlier, but the majority of Prime Ministers here (functionally the head of government) during my lifetime came to the office in their 40s. I note Cameron and Blair in the UK were in the same age bracket.
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