The PyCon Incident • Hacker News Board

Re: The PyCon Incident

#161

Post by antirez » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 11:06 PM UTC

This Andria that I don't know who she is at all and I don't care may be in error, or in bad faith, or whatever. But remember that to get another person fired you need a stupid cultural movement that is addressing sexism in the wrong way. So to start, blame the multitude of people that put the discussion at a level that the ancient greeks would mark as primitive.

EDIT: On Reddit there is a comment that explains much better my point of view. http://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/1am37v/technolog...

Re: The PyCon Incident

#162

Post by crag » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 11:06 PM UTC

wpietri wrote: post #101

crag wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

BS. I'm getting sick and tired of people not taking responsibility for their actions. Now I do agree with you somewhat. I doubt she saw this "joke" as an opportunity to screw someone over (at least I hope so. If she did, then all bets are off); but that doesn't excuse her wrong. Her actions caused this guy to be fired. She needs to own it. Apoligize, Offer amends and move on.

Note where you stop in the causal chain: with the woman. You could blame the millennia of sexism that set up the situation. You could blame the gender-imbalanced context: it's easy for humans to be insensitive to minority views. You could blame the guy's parents and teachers for not raising him right. You could blame the guy for saying something inappropriate. You could blame his friends for not reigning him in. You…

"Ask yourself: why is she the one you chose to focus on?"

You're right. The guys need to own-up for their stupidity too. Oh that's right, they never got the chance. She didn't confront them. She snapped a picture and tweeted.

And I agree about their employer. In fact, I'd love to know who the employer was?

Re: The PyCon Incident

#163

Post by dandellion » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 11:06 PM UTC

tomjakubowski wrote: post #51

blhack wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know, I've been thinking... It's also pretty unprofessional to wear jeans to work, and beer after 4:00pm on Friday is just a lawsuit waiting to happen. Also the schedule that the developers keep is really unprofessional. If one of the accountants tried to show up at 11:00am, they'd be fired! I also saw some pictures of one of our devs at Burning Man last year. He was wearing some sort of black, canvas skirt, and…

Starting a 'nerf war' at work is entirely unprofessional, and I hope to never work with someone who is so childish as to think that's reasonable workplace behavior.

A 'nerf war' might be something acceptable as long as:

1. the work environment allows it

2. the participants agree to it

3. it's done in at the appropiate time (during a break, for example)

Games and childish behaviour are different things and, according to one of my professors, not being able to distinguish between them is a sign of immaturity.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#164

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 11:06 PM UTC

emiljbs wrote: post #94

llimllib wrote: post #46

Again I would like to point out that to slander somebody, you must tell lies about them. Nobody is claiming that Adria is lying , even the person she's talking about. She is clearly not slandering anyone. (Please note: this does not mean that I'm taking a position in any way on this issue)

Pretty sure she fabricated the "forking"-joke.

[deleted]

Re: The PyCon Incident

#165

Post by clinth » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 11:07 PM UTC

SODaniel wrote: post #70

ajross wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's cool down a little here. An irresponsible tweet doesn't really constitute a "personal vendetta" (it's not even personal -- as far as I can tell she never knew their names). And while the post was (apparently, I don't know what the evidence here is) the proximate cause, you really can't say that she "got [him] fired", as she wasn't the employer nor did she advocate for his termination. It's just a bad situation…

Personal vendetta or not. A person that reacts to a private conversation (inappropriate or not) by posting hearsay about two co-workers to 1000s of followers the way she did is NOT a person I would want to work with, even less hire. She has at the very least shown very bad judgement and should not be commended nor rewarded for it.

You mean personal conversation. Their conversation wasn't private, it was in the middle of a conference hall.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#166

Post by lizzard » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 11:07 PM UTC

SODaniel wrote: post #70

ajross wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's cool down a little here. An irresponsible tweet doesn't really constitute a "personal vendetta" (it's not even personal -- as far as I can tell she never knew their names). And while the post was (apparently, I don't know what the evidence here is) the proximate cause, you really can't say that she "got [him] fired", as she wasn't the employer nor did she advocate for his termination. It's just a bad situation…

Personal vendetta or not. A person that reacts to a private conversation (inappropriate or not) by posting hearsay about two co-workers to 1000s of followers the way she did is NOT a person I would want to work with, even less hire. She has at the very least shown very bad judgement and should not be commended nor rewarded for it.

Reporting on something we've directly experienced isn't hearsay and they weren't her co-workers. As women we need to be able to speak in public forums about our experiences without this sort of extreme harassment as the result.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#167

Post by sp332 » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 11:07 PM UTC

blhack wrote: post #31

ajross wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's cool down a little here. An irresponsible tweet doesn't really constitute a "personal vendetta" (it's not even personal -- as far as I can tell she never knew their names). And while the post was (apparently, I don't know what the evidence here is) the proximate cause, you really can't say that she "got [him] fired", as she wasn't the employer nor did she advocate for his termination. It's just a bad situation…

It went further than that, though. http://butyoureagirl.com/14015/forking-and-dongle-jokes-dont...

This gives a lot of context and was very helpful, thank you.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#168

Post by leviathant » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 11:07 PM UTC

emiljbs wrote: post #94

llimllib wrote: post #46

Again I would like to point out that to slander somebody, you must tell lies about them. Nobody is claiming that Adria is lying , even the person she's talking about. She is clearly not slandering anyone. (Please note: this does not mean that I'm taking a position in any way on this issue)

Pretty sure she fabricated the "forking"-joke.

In light of https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5398681 I'd be interested to hear why you are pretty sure she fabricated the forking joke. I'm not agreeing with taking offense to what was said, but she didn't make up that someone said "I would fork that guys repo"

Re: The PyCon Incident

#169

Post by basqio » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 11:07 PM UTC

wpietri wrote: post #101

crag wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

BS. I'm getting sick and tired of people not taking responsibility for their actions. Now I do agree with you somewhat. I doubt she saw this "joke" as an opportunity to screw someone over (at least I hope so. If she did, then all bets are off); but that doesn't excuse her wrong. Her actions caused this guy to be fired. She needs to own it. Apoligize, Offer amends and move on.

Note where you stop in the causal chain: with the woman. You could blame the millennia of sexism that set up the situation. You could blame the gender-imbalanced context: it's easy for humans to be insensitive to minority views. You could blame the guy's parents and teachers for not raising him right. You could blame the guy for saying something inappropriate. You could blame his friends for not reigning him in. You…

Just because a woman is to blame does not prove sexism. It is quite reasonable to say that she holds most of the responsibility in this situation by not reacting to the comments in a professional way. The jokes were hardly sexist and more anatomical and if that bothers he she could have dealt with it in a different way. But I guess I am sexist too for having the opinion that she handled the situation incorrectly right?

Re: The PyCon Incident

#170

Post by InternalRun » Wed, Mar 20, 2013, 11:08 PM UTC

outside1234 wrote: post #143

I don't get it. Are there folks amongst us that really so socially inept that they think its ok to make a dick joke at a conference regardless of context? Its a professional conference and that is not professional behavior.

Not what people are angry about, yes they were wrong but she blew it up. She didn't need to publicly attack them on Twitter without even asking them to stop. She was also making jokes just like them on Twitter.