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Bullying has to stop, now.

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Re: Bullying has to stop, now.

#111

Post by Nursie »

pmahoney wrote: post #108
Nursie wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At age 9 people used to take my stuff and occasionally bully me in a sort of low-grade way. Until I beat the tar out of the main offender. You get a reputation as the smart/nerdy guy that once smashed the jock's head into a wall and nobody really bothers you again. Bullying should absolutely be stopped by other means, but when it comes down to it these are animal level dominance games amongst young apes and violence…

One of my fears about telling kids to defend themselves with force is what if the bully has a gang of friends? An older brother? Access to a weapon? How likely is it that a bully, finally beaten by the victim, escalates further?

I have no idea, that would be a study for a psychologist.

I just know that people tend to stop bothering you if you show them you aren't a pushover. You don't have to beat them into the dirt, you just have to hit back.

Re: Bullying has to stop, now.

#112

Post by Mz »

digitalengineer wrote: post #100
Mz wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I don't mind at all. Thank you.

I'm trying to educate my little girl in standing up for herself. The thing is she is kind and considerate, even to bullies. She's doing judo now and when she's 7 she wants to do kids-Krav Maga. I hope that helps her understand she is not powerless. (Krav Maga for kids is also about understanding bullies and situations).

Please do not mistake kind and considerate for powerless. One of my favorite stories is of a woman who decided to walk out on a class about "empowerment" rather than learn to yell at people. One of the other students said "God, what a bitch" as she quietly left rather than take her turn dutifully berating people.

Re: Bullying has to stop, now.

#113

Post by mtoddh »

manicdee wrote: post #32
brador wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What would you have liked the adults to do to solve the problem? What could they have done?

Not punish the kid defending himself with a chair? Not punish the kid hitting back at someone who was bullying him? Not punish the kid who beat up the bully? It actually helps to have some idea of what's going on in the school yard, ask witnesses what was going on, and IF KIDS COMPLAIN ABOUT BULLYING DON'T TELL THEM TO GET OVER IT. "You're not making an effort to fit in" is blaming the victim. I'm not making the fuck…

Here's an idea- start holding adults to the exact same standards we hold kids, and then watch how fast policies change:

Co-worker makes racist remarks towards you: "sticks and stones" speech

Co-worker sexually harasses you: "sticks and stones" speech

Co-worker physically assaults you: "sticks and stones" speech, with added punishment if the victim defends himself

And in each case, tell the adult victim how they should be more empathetic to the bully's lot in life.

Re: Bullying has to stop, now.

#114

Post by mac1175 »

Tichy wrote: post #9

The thing that strikes me about school is that people are pretty much locked into it. Once you get out of that system, if you are surrounded by nasty people, you can usually just leave. That's what I do, anyway. With school, not so much luck - it's possible to transfer to another school, but it's usually not very easy to pull of. Of course the feeling of not being liked sticks, too, but perhaps it wouldn't even manif…

This is so damn true! My grades suffered in high school because of occasional bullying. This caused frequent feeling of uncertainty if I was to run into people who I would rather avoid. I remember sleeping when I got home from school because the emotional toll was exhausting. However, the only thing that kept me going was knowing that I would reinvent myself after I got out of high school.

The 'locked in' part is a huge factor. High school was a prison to me. Once I had a choice, my life id an absolute turn around. One other thing to add is that pride added to the problem. To tell my parents I was being bullied was impossible. So, this makes you isolated with your own mental anguish.

Re: Bullying has to stop, now.

#116

Post by mac1175 »

hvs wrote: post #101
petercooper wrote: post #36

Going off on a tangent here, but do people who are good at sports often suffer long term bullying at school? I wasn't bullied at school, IMHO (nothing physical, the odd bit of name calling.. which they got back ;-)) but it seemed as if people who were into sports avoided every hassle, including the sportier geeks who were in the football team, etc. Looking back, I have to wonder if there's something about being activ…

Some of the worst bullying I received was in locker rooms. Don't kid yourself. It can happen anywhere.

I remember being bullied every day my freshman year. The bully was on my cross country track team. I wonder what would have happened if I never joined track.

Re: Bullying has to stop, now.

#117

Post by coldtea »

barry-cotter wrote: post #33
ErrantX wrote: post #15

I don't think anything has touched me this deeply for years. I even got a little teary (which is rare for me). A lot of this I can relate to. School was hell for me, and I still struggle to forgive the adults around me during that period who, despite knowing what I (and others) faced, failed us utterly. Of course, school is rough and tumble - but when things went too far they sympathised, and in some rare cases talke…

But what can we do? Kids will be kids, eh? End age based classes would be a good start.

Because getting bullied from kids 2-3 years old would be so much better?

Re: Bullying has to stop, now.

#118

Post by coldtea »

polymatter wrote: post #62
babarock wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I completely agree that age-based classes is stupid. But what's the alternative? The idea of classifying 5 year old kids based on any kind of factor scares the hell out of me.

Erm, what scares you about ability-based classes? The single strongest motivator for me to do well at school was to get into the top set which was free from bullies.

>Erm, what scares you about ability-based classes?

The fascist premise of "let's separate the most able from the riff-raff".

As if society should be a hierarchical pyramid of top dogs and underdogs.

Re: Bullying has to stop, now.

#119

Post by coldtea »

jerf wrote: post #95
cathustler wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The kid with a myth of a father, and a mother who trades out her allotted food-stamps for drug money is a thug? Bullies aren't born, they're created; I have not once met a bully who had a perfect life before they decided to get angry and take it out on their peers, because, well, they don't know any better. So, yes, kids will be kids.

OK, but what's your point? So the bully has a hard life. OK, yes, that's true, so sad (really, no sarcasm), but what do you plan on doing about it? Your argument often ends up implicitly turning into "Therefore, we shouldn't punish the bully, it's not his fault. Therefore, I guess, well, we'll do nothing." You've cognitively narrowed your focus to just the bully and forgotten everyone else who is getting bullied. Tha…

>OK, but what's your point? So the bully has a hard life. OK, yes, that's true, so sad (really, no sarcasm), but what do you plan on doing about it?

Oh, some kids get bullied at at school. Oh, the humanity.

Really, first world problems of the highest caliber...

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