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Dolphins Call Each Other By Name

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Re: Dolphins Call Each Other By Name

#121

Post by rogerbinns »

nviarnes wrote: post #111
networked wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since the great white shark needs to move to breathe [1] I assume that holding one long enough would cause it to suffocate, right? [1] http://science.howstuffworks.com/zoology/marine-life/shark-d...

As someone who has seen a great white shark underwater from 15 feet away (shark caging), I can safely say that there is no human alive capable of holding a great white shark still. There is simply no stopping a 20ft long, 4000lb., aquatic dinosaur. Unless you're an orca I suppose. One of the most impressive and intimidating animals I have ever seen.

I recommend reading "The Devils Teeth" http://www.amazon.com/The-Devils-Teeth-Obsession-Survival/dp...

Excusing the anthropomorphisation, one interesting tidbit is that the great whites have different personalities. Some were just plain mean while others were playful.

Re: Dolphins Call Each Other By Name

#122

Post by elliptic »

ekianjo wrote: post #118
eitland wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because history (esp. European history I guess) will show you that brilliant techies have done really cruel things.

Yet history shows that the greatest "techies" (Kepler, Newton, Galileo, and others) did not work alone and were certainly depending on others to establish their theories and measurements - and many were very much "humanists" and universal thinkers who cared very little about politics and frontiers. Even Einstein who was a key player in developing nuclear power was against any use of it in military conflict. So, I wou…

I believe Newton and Galileo worked alone for much of their lives. Kepler was far more intellectually generous.

Re: Dolphins Call Each Other By Name

#123

Post by stcredzero »

nviarnes wrote: post #111
networked wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since the great white shark needs to move to breathe [1] I assume that holding one long enough would cause it to suffocate, right? [1] http://science.howstuffworks.com/zoology/marine-life/shark-d...

As someone who has seen a great white shark underwater from 15 feet away (shark caging), I can safely say that there is no human alive capable of holding a great white shark still. There is simply no stopping a 20ft long, 4000lb., aquatic dinosaur. Unless you're an orca I suppose. One of the most impressive and intimidating animals I have ever seen.

> Unless you're an orca I suppose.

I don't care if you're a big bad orca. If you can kill a freakin Great White Shark by holding it, that's some mf badass Kung-fu shit right there. Orcas are big and strong, but they're just flesh and bone. It's not like they're armor plated, or have electrified dive cages. It's just them, this technique, and a 5000 pound thrashing, efficiently killing, natural flesh sawing machine. Sure, they weigh like 2.5 times as much, but it would still be like me subduing an attack dog with some kind of technique. I outweigh it, but it's still scary. Personally, I'd rather just be far, far away.

Re: Dolphins Call Each Other By Name

#124

Post by stcredzero »

krapp wrote: post #76
noonespecial wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder (seriously) if I learned to create these rings myself, would I earn mad dolphin cred?

Once humans can do it, it's probably no longer cool.

I bet they'd think it hilarious if you could fart them.

Re: Dolphins Call Each Other By Name

#125

Post by PavlovsCat »

lifeisstillgood wrote: post #64
stcredzero wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They also have what appears to be fratricide were they bludgeon another to death targeting vital organs Apparently Orcas have developed this Kung-fu like thing, where they can kill a shark by just holding it . http://worldtourwhilediving.com/2012/01/13/orca-flips-over-g...

This is a form of "tonic immobility" in sharks (chickens have the same reaction if held whilst looking at a line drawn away from them) It's an attempt to feign death / stand immobile whilst danger passes. Its effective in sharks as they need water passing over their gills so if they stop swimming they are dependant on current. Of course orcas are big enough to turn a shark over - your average guy in a chain mail suit…

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apparent_death

"With tiger sharks 3–4 metres (10 to 15 feet) in length, tonic immobility may be achieved by placing hands lightly on the sides of the animal's snout approximate to the general area surrounding its eyes."

Nah, that sounds easy.. ^^

Re: Dolphins Call Each Other By Name

#126

Post by PostOnce »

ComputerGuru wrote: post #105

Any thread on dolphins is not complete without a link to the 1992 NYT article on dolphins: [ http://www.nytimes.com/1992/02/18/science/dolphin-courtship-... ] Here's the sad part: none of this is new. 1992. 1992. Over twenty years ago. As children they make a best friend for life, they form complicated alliances for mutual benefit, they form political alliances/gangs, they help each other out both tit-for-tat and "pr…

That article says they use dolphins for meat and income. It seems a little easy to sit in an armchair next to a fridge full of supermarket-bought food and complain about what islanders do to eat. Presumably, the money they claim they weren't paid would've been used on other sources of food, and when unpaid, went back to what they were doing before, with a little extra effort to piss off the non payers.

Re: Dolphins Call Each Other By Name

#127

Post by philwelch »

yareally wrote: post #106
ekianjo wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do not have to go back very far to find barbary even in our civilization ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert-Fran%C3%A7ois_Damiens ) and this happened in the same century as the human rights philosophers. That was just a few generations ago.

Heh, that's funny, I was just watching a 3 part BBC Documentary on Versailles[1] (part 1 Louis XIV, part 2 Louis XV, part 3 Louis XVI). They talked quite a bit about Louis XV's attempted assassination and Damiens. From what was said, most other countries were appalled at the execution style. I'd still say The Terror and Great Terror during the French Revolution were far more barbaric while masquerading in the name of…

I'd say the Russians pulled the same trick a century later. There were other butchers much more recently, but communism is the most recent example of butchery masquerading as enlightenment.

Re: Dolphins Call Each Other By Name

#128

Post by philwelch »

s-v wrote: post #63
leoh wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel the same way about projects looking into habitation of foreign planets. The science and the engineering behind the endeavor is interesting, but why seriously not start thinking about and practicing sustainability in places like Antarctica?

Colonizing another planet is a hedge against a destructive event (asteroid, bomb, etc) completely extinguishing the human species.

Colonizing another planet would be a speciating event. Alpha Centurians would become a different species anyway, just like a population of birds that gets stranded on a remote island becomes a different species.

Re: Dolphins Call Each Other By Name

#129

Post by epidemian »

PostOnce wrote: post #126
ComputerGuru wrote: post #105

Any thread on dolphins is not complete without a link to the 1992 NYT article on dolphins: [ http://www.nytimes.com/1992/02/18/science/dolphin-courtship-... ] Here's the sad part: none of this is new. 1992. 1992. Over twenty years ago. As children they make a best friend for life, they form complicated alliances for mutual benefit, they form political alliances/gangs, they help each other out both tit-for-tat and "pr…

That article says they use dolphins for meat and income. It seems a little easy to sit in an armchair next to a fridge full of supermarket-bought food and complain about what islanders do to eat. Presumably, the money they claim they weren't paid would've been used on other sources of food, and when unpaid, went back to what they were doing before, with a little extra effort to piss off the non payers.

While i'm not sure i agree with you or the grand-parent post†, i think your argument doesn't help refuting the grand-parent's main point.

ComputerGuru's main point was showing how similar dolphins are to humans, in the way they live and socialize, and stating that, because of those reasons, killing them is wrong. Yes, they might be doing it for their own living, but that doesn't make it any less wrong. In the end, we all work for our food, or to cover our needs in general, but that does not justify the work of paid assassins for example, or any other job that directly threatens other humans' lives.

† I'm kind of in a cognitive dissonance state about killing animals for eating, as i do consider animals to be not different in essence to humans --i think that our difference are only quantitative instead of qualitative-- but at the same time i eat animal meat, so i'm contributing to their killing.

Re: Dolphins Call Each Other By Name

#130

Post by ekianjo »

yareally wrote: post #119
ekianjo wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'd still say The Terror and Great Terror during the French Revolution were far more barbaric while masquerading in the name of enlightenment though Totally agree with you, and I certainly despise the national celebration of that hideous genocide (and there is no other word for it) called "the revolution" although I am French myself. By the way, Robespierre was not the only one responsible (Marat, St-Just and other…

Yep, all very true and totally agree. Never just one individual responsible, I just dropped the name of the biggest one for the sake of briefness. I think it was Danton that said something like, "My only regret is to go before that rat Robespierre" when he was giving his last words after being arrested for realizing how screwed up the revolution had become with his and other's control of The Committee of Public Safet…

> Jean-Paul Marat was made out to be a martyr on his death instead of despised for his role in fueling the flames.

Very true. He was well known to be claiming "100 000 tetes doivent tomber" (100 000 heads must fall) in order to get rid of the so-called "internal enemies". Interestingly, while he had a "martyr" image, so did Charlotte Corday (who killed him) at least in the eye of numerous writers post-Revolution.

If you are really into the story of the french revolution, I would really, absolutely recommend you watch the movie "La Revolution Francaise" made in 1989, in two parts of 3 hours each. It's very faithful to the spirit of the time, the actors are all excellent and you can really see how everything spins out of control progressively. Brilliant movie, sadly only distributed in France as far as I know. Contact me (check my profile) if you are interested.

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