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Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

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Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#751

Post by tristor »

xnx wrote: post #734
estebank wrote: post #458

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Earlier today saw a guy on a pick up truck griefing an empty Waymo by brake checking and boxing it, all over the road for about 10 minutes and over 5 blocks (no idea how much earlier it started), causing every other driver to freak out or be confused about what was going on. All the while all I could think was "you're spending your time making it more likely for a collision to happen, all to 'anger' a toaster with 36…

Some group (my bet is on "transit advocates") will try and paint Waymo as "Flock on wheels".

Well, they basically are. But that's not alone a good enough argument against SDVs.

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#752

Post by ericmay »

pbkompasz wrote: post #532
ericmay wrote: post #452

The safest car is the one that is parked. I’m not anti-car but in terms of safety we should focus more on getting people using bus/rail/bike/walk especially for daily needs. It’s more cost effective too. Autonomous cars are cool and will be great for reducing crashes, but it’s an additive solution, not a subtractive one.

Yes, instead of fixing the problem let's go back 100 years and start walking everywhere. It's easy for someone that works for home or an in office, but most people truly rely on their cars, otherwise they would lose hours everyday...

> but most people truly rely on their cars, otherwise they would lose hours everyday...

They lose hours, lives, and a boatload of money every day in the current state. Removing the reliance on cars will improve those things.

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#753

Post by oblio »

1970-01-01 wrote: post #672
oblio wrote: post #619

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Demand is based on time of day/week/month/year. Where do all those cars needed during peak demand go? They're going to be parked somewhere and it's not going to be in the middle of nowhere, because that's an awful customer experience.

The same place as existing taxis and busses? Busses are a worse customer experience than a 10 minute wait.

Do you realize the order of magnitude in difference?

If we end up having as many self driving cars as taxis, they can just terminate Waymo tomorrow, what's the point in investing tens of billions? The goal is to replace many or most of the cars on the road.

https://john-s-allen.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/mue...

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#754

Post by oersted »

My_Name wrote: post #745
oersted wrote: post #726

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes but in practice the pushback is more about the shift on who is held responsible and who has the control to prevent a crash. People understandably prefer to keep control of their own safety, even if on average they are worse at it. Because individuals that do care about safety can actually do many things to lower the risks well below the statistics, and likely remain much better than self-driving. There’s also the…

I completely agree. I feel a lot of pushback is likely to be coming from insurance companies who very much like being able to hike up your premium because they have decided that you as a person are a bad risk. When the entity that had the accident is some software and sensors made by a company, they can't do that. I disagree that the safety concerns have to be on an individual basis, no other driving regulation works…

These are good points. I still think that, even if in principle it should be enough for self-driving to be a bit more safe on average, in practice there’s a much larger barrier of acceptance.

Individuals are unlikely to give up their control unless the alternative is clearly substantially better. And, as you say, there are other larger interests beyond individual preferences that need to be overcome too.

Regardless, as we have seen many times with other technologies, I think that convenience will be a much stronger driver of self-driving acceptance than the safety benefit.

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#755

Post by threethirtytwo »

jeffbee wrote: post #410

I love this conversation as the death spasm of driver culture. On the one hand, a lot of hard data. On the other hand, myths.

Ai is slaughtering the identities of everyone around it. Years of skills, dedication and experience rendered useless by a genuinely superior AI.

So what do people do? They have to deny it. They have to make up stories, they have to lie to themselves. Normally HN is all about being data driven and logical. But you can see here that with AI this isn’t the case.

When your identity is about to be eviscerated all logic goes out the window. I deal with it by having no identity. I never placed pride in anything.

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#756

Post by hiddencost »

YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #433

>> In March, Waymo’s independent study showed 92 percent fewer fatal or serious-injury crashes, a 13-fold reduction versus human drivers in comparable city environments. I can't progress beyond this point in the article. How is Waymo's study "independent"? I don't understand.

The study was done by one of the most respected and independent groups out there (insurance companies have a very high incentive to know what's real here). Waymo provided the data and probably helped pay for it.

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#757

Post by kamarg »

vrosas wrote: post #143
marssaxman wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rental scooters/bikes cover last mile service very well in my experience. I use transit a great deal more than I would if I had to walk so much on either end of the trip.

Americans would rather die than give up their air conditioned bubbles on wheels. I've wondered why someone hasn't tried manufacturing an enclosed go kart with AC and enough trunk space for a few groceries.

Because most people feel uncomfortable being in the tiny vehicle that sits below the bumber of all the trucks and suvs that surround them. It's one of those things that doesn't work until a large percentage of other people are doing it. Very few want to put themselves in more danger for principled reasons.

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#758

Post by MithrilTuxedo »

giantg2 wrote: post #234

Better driver education and higher test standards would save lives too. So would banning alcohol. None of these solutions, including automated cars, will be mandated any time soon. It's not enough to have data, you also have to have societal buy-in. Interesting that Waymo chooses to compare accident rates with the average driver vs the rideshare drivers their cars replace. The numbers wouldn't look as impressive beca…

>It's not enough to have data, you also have to have societal buy-in.

Insurance rates are based on data.

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#759

Post by tonymet »

Violations and collisions are not uniformly distributed. A minority of drivers cause the preponderance of collisions. Eventually these misunderstood stats will lead to everyone having their driving privileges revoked, when in reality, only the worst drivers should be banned. And in many cases, stellar drivers will be at greater risk of harm by being forced to ride in an automated car.

Re: Growing proof that autonomous cars save lives

#760

Post by WD-42 »

oblio wrote: post #617
tgsovlerkhgsel wrote: post #575

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The giant spot of land could be in a much less convenient (= valuable) location if the car can take itself to and from there.

No. That's false. Riders will want a car to be at their location ASAP, or they will try to call another company. So the incentive will be to put/drive cars very close to where people are. That whole "cars will be stored at the periphery" is propaganda.

And this is worse than 2 cars in every driveway how?
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