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Verschlimmbesserung: The Word Your Software Updates Need

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Re: Verschlimmbesserung: The Word Your Software Updates Need

#121

Post by N_Lens »

ThrowawayR2 wrote: post #73
mrgoldenbrown wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Gabe is an example of how you can stop at absurdly rich and still make your customers happy. The enshittification is only necessary to go beyond absurdly rich.

He's somewhere in the top 300 wealthiest people in the world; forget one-percenter, that's something like top 0.00001%. He definitely has done a lot of nice things for gaming and I hope he continues to do so for the rest of his days but let's not pretend he's not beyond absurdly rich.

I think there’s two separate things here that you seem to be conflating - absurdly rich and unethical. I’d argue Newell is mostly the former; though many or most billionaires align on both those metrics.

Re: Verschlimmbesserung: The Word Your Software Updates Need

#122

Post by N_Lens »

andai wrote: post #100
ThrowawayR2 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gabe Newell has an $11bn net worth so he hasn't exactly been not squeezing.

Is Coca Cola squeezing me, too?

Yes? Read about their water rights lobbying and lobbying against plastic recycling regulations. Our descendents have to deal with Coca Cola’s externalities. You can’t see these second order effects immediately, which is understandable, but coca cola is massively extractive.

Re: Verschlimmbesserung: The Word Your Software Updates Need

#123

Post by croes »

OroPla wrote: post #97
alpaca128 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just calling it bad does not include the intent of improving it. Verschlimmbesserung does.

Why do you change something if not to make it better, though? Trying to improve things is implicit.

The point of Verschlimmbesserung is to show your good intentions to improve something failed.

Improvement = Verbesserung

Worsening = Verschlimmerung

Worsening because you tried to improve = Verschlimmbesserung

Ask your local carpenter or plumber how many of their jobs have to do with people trying to fix a damage and make it worse

Re: Verschlimmbesserung: The Word Your Software Updates Need

#124

Post by 1718627440 »

Youden wrote: post #52
OroPla wrote: post #36

German here. A "Verschlimmbesserung" is something that makes one part better and another part worse. If it only makes things worse you don't need a German word for it, you can just call it worse. For things that were intended good, but ended up bad, there's an English idiom: the path to hell is paved with good intentions.

Not a German but Duden disagrees with you [0]: "etwas in der Absicht, es zu verbessern, schlechter machen". [0]: https://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/verschlimmbessern

But you rarely only worsen it in every direction.

Re: Verschlimmbesserung: The Word Your Software Updates Need

#125

Post by 1718627440 »

OroPla wrote: post #97
alpaca128 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just calling it bad does not include the intent of improving it. Verschlimmbesserung does.

Why do you change something if not to make it better, though? Trying to improve things is implicit.

Worsen it from the perspective of the judge, not from the person doing it.

Re: Verschlimmbesserung: The Word Your Software Updates Need

#126

Post by 1718627440 »

heresie-dabord wrote: post #58
OroPla wrote: post #36

German here. A "Verschlimmbesserung" is something that makes one part better and another part worse. If it only makes things worse you don't need a German word for it, you can just call it worse. For things that were intended good, but ended up bad, there's an English idiom: the path to hell is paved with good intentions.

> For things that were intended good, but ended up bad, there's an English idiom: Better is the enemy of good. Old Italian proverb: "il meglio è nemico del bene" Shakespeare, King Lear: "Striving to better, oft we mar what's well".

> Better is the enemy of good.

That's not the same at all. The idea there is that if you try to make the best, you will stop advancing towards good, not that you will worsen it.

Re: Verschlimmbesserung: The Word Your Software Updates Need

#127

Post by 1718627440 »

WesolyKubeczek wrote: post #43
eqvinox wrote: post #9

It's actually a verb, "Verschlimmbesserung" is the substantivization. Base: verschlimmbessern Present conjugation: I verschlimmbesser[e], you verschlimmbesserst, he/she/it verschlimmbessert, we verschlimmbesser[e]n, (plural-)you verschlimmbessert, they verschlimmbesser[e]n Past/perfect: verschlimmbessert (e.g. "it got verschlimmbessert") Imperative: verschlimmbesser[e] (e.g. "don't verschlimmbesser that!") The [e] at…

Would there be a semantic difference between Verschlimmbesserung and Verbesserschlimmung?

(German) Words do not work like that. First, it's called 'schlimmer', so -> "Verbesserschlimmerung". Second "schlimm" is positiv, while "besser" is the comparativ, so you need to swap these too: "schlimmer" and "gut".

Also the genesis of the word works like this: "besser" -> "bessern" -> "verbessern" -> "verschlimmbessern" -> "Verschlimmbesserung" (better -> becoming better -> making better -> making better towards a worse state -> same, but as noun) So you append to the beginning, while keeping the existing prefix. If you want to end up with "worse" at the end, you need to start with it too. "schlecht" -> "verschlechtern" -> ??? But then "gut" doesn't fit, because that implies an absolute, that "schlimm" does not.

Note, that "schlimm" does not plainly mean "bad", that's "schlecht". It also contains the notion of pity, guilt and impotence. That doesn't really exist for the opposite.

Re: Verschlimmbesserung: The Word Your Software Updates Need

#128

Post by 1718627440 »

car wrote: post #85
Krasnol wrote: post #3

I'd say enshitification is a good enough word. Verschlimmbesserung is not widely used these days in Germany.

How about Verscheisserung / Verschisserung? I do like the sound of Verscheissification. As Picard said: Enshitify! (Apologies to my Trekkie friends.)

> Verscheisserung

That already means "prank".

> Verschisserung

"Schisser" means coward.

Re: Verschlimmbesserung: The Word Your Software Updates Need

#129

Post by ThrowawayR2 »

eqvinox wrote: post #75
ThrowawayR2 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The sibling post's "disimprovement" sounds more natural and has parallel form with pre-existing broadly accepted English words like "disincentive" and "disinfect".

Not sure if that's just me, but "disimprovement" sounds like *removing* an improvement that was previously there…

An improvement isn't all or nothing, it can be incremental. The dis- prefix only indicates that the increment is negative in this case.
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