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Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

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Re: Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

#151

Post by Ralfp »

zelphirkalt wrote: post #93

What I don't like about Htmx is, that it is still a JS framework, without good automatic fallbacks for a noscript situation. This leads to web devs thinking it would be great to do all the things in Htmx, even if all they have is a static page with static content. Just recently I looked at hosting an old school forum. I don't want to load all the PHP and MySQL baggage on my server or even run it in docker, so I looke…

> So now I am building my own forum completely without JS, and with Python Django doing a lot of heavy lifting.

Later this year I will be releasing Misago 0.40, which is a near complete rewrite from React.js to HTMX, with rest of features to follow in 2027. And yes, noscripy support is part of it.

https://misago-project.org/t/removing-reactjs-from-the-codeb...

Re: Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

#152

Post by throw2ih020 »

robertoandred wrote: post #124
throw2ih020 wrote: post #16

HTMX is awesome. I've replaced several OSS web apps on my home server with HTMX + Go + PostgreSQL replacements. The results are lightweight, responsive, work great on desktop and mobile alike, all with the absolute minimum complexity required. The codebases are easy to understand and modify, and so far I'm going months between updates (mostly just minor bugfixes for my applications). I fully expec my mature apps will…

How does introducing a third layer reduce complexity?

I'm replacing existing third-party applications which have complex JavaScript frameworks with my "in house" apps using HTMX + mostly just HTML+CSS for most pages and functionality. i.e. I'm not introducing a layer, I'm replacing one.

Why not just use html without HTMX you ask? With HTMX I don't have to reload the entire page to navigate, which is especially helpful for making the app responsive even on low bandwidth connections like a bad cell signal.

Re: Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

#153

Post by troupo »

yawaramin wrote: post #125
robertoandred wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HTMX is just as JS compute heavy. It's not magic.

How is htmx ‘just as JS compute heavy’? It’s doing way less than your average SPA. Have you seen the sizes of the JS bundles of popular SPAs? They make htmx look microscopic in comparison.

It's a 14kb library that invents its own templating syntax and DSL and also requires the backend to conform to its DSL.

Yes, it's smaller than some other frameworks, but let's stop with "doesn't require JS" nd other bullshit

Re: Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

#155

Post by arcanemachiner »

Incipient wrote: post #10
antihero wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was against it for ages but having have claude use it in a simple project and being frankly sick/bored of React, it seems nice.

I personally find react overly engineered for my projects - vuejs (+quasar on top) is just great. Granted a little boring perhaps, but it just works, behaves as you'd expect, and doing anything just isn't that difficult.

Wow, quasar is still around?

It seems to be pretty niche, but I've only ever heard good things about it.

Re: Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

#157

Post by oaxacaoaxaca »

threecheese wrote: post #107
antihero wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was against it for ages but having have claude use it in a simple project and being frankly sick/bored of React, it seems nice.

Any comments on how you’re holding it? Just “Hey Claude use htmx”?

v4 is in beta and the source has some skills files. And for me personally I'm slowly building my own rules, like not having dialogs live hidden in the main page; instead, every button that triggers a dialog should do so via an htmx call that returns a dialog and appends it to the body. And then setting rules for how Claude should write templates, leveraging Django's new partialdef feature.

Re: Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

#158

Post by asdfsa32 »

gulugawa wrote: post #144
asdfsa32 wrote: post #135

Is there any substantial web app written htmx? I find htmx ideal for things that should be static to begin with, and for things that are dynamic, I fail to see how it can handle synchronisation? I believe Github is using similar technology and their notifications indicators and counter are almost always broken and out of sync.

https://htmx.org/essays/paris-2024-olympics-htmx-network-aut...

Yeah, it is interesting that most people who promote htmx are not "insiders" (for the lack of a better word that isn't loaded like "expert").

Re: Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

#159

Post by asdfsa32 »

brutella wrote: post #146
asdfsa32 wrote: post #135

Is there any substantial web app written htmx? I find htmx ideal for things that should be static to begin with, and for things that are dynamic, I fail to see how it can handle synchronisation? I believe Github is using similar technology and their notifications indicators and counter are almost always broken and out of sync.

I'm using htmx in the hkknx web app to control smart home accessories. https://hkknx.hochgatterer.me/

And it doesn't load, guess what would load just fine? a React app hosted on a cdn.

Re: Htmx 4.0, the first JavaScript library to release exclusively on the Game Boy

#160

Post by Dylan16807 »

rtpg wrote: post #110
nasretdinov wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's great but I believe it's still over-engineered. Unless it's a web site that can tolerate no downtime at all during schema updates, SQLite in WAL2 mode is more than enough. Moreover, in Postgres version upgrades can't be done without significant downtime (or setting up replication and performing a complex dance), so even that isn't so cut and dry.

> Unless it's a web site that can tolerate no downtime at all during schema updates, SQLite in WAL2 mode is more than enough. I do think that people really underestimate how quickly a system starts being "please, no downtime" (or its weaker cousin, "please, don't make your ops people do rollouts at 1AM"). Like obviously it's not the end of the world but the default assumption of "the system is up" makes a loooooot of…

Trying to have so few blips they're invisible to bug tracking is a very expensive level of uptime. It takes a lot of convenience to add up that high, compared to ignoring errors for thirty seconds at noon.
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