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New Framework Desktop Option with AMD Ryzen AI Max+ Pro 495 and 192GB Memory

frame.work

51–60 of 117 posts

Re: New Framework Desktop Option with AMD Ryzen AI Max+ Pro 495 and 192GB Memory

#51
post #2

I have a framework desktop w/ 128GB that I bought last Christmas and if I’m looking at it right it costs $2000 (CAD) more now because of the RAM shortage (and in any event is apparently out of stock). Would love to have 192 GB but I’m not sure I can justify buying another. Does anyone have a sense of how this might progress, e.g if I can get a 256 or 512 GB in a year if I wait. In any case I’m jealous this exists and…

The market research I have seen indicated DRAM prices will not come back to “normal” until 2030 at least and probably 2031. You can wait, but it will probably be longer than a year

Re: New Framework Desktop Option with AMD Ryzen AI Max+ Pro 495 and 192GB Memory

#52
post #12
post #2

I have a framework desktop w/ 128GB that I bought last Christmas and if I’m looking at it right it costs $2000 (CAD) more now because of the RAM shortage (and in any event is apparently out of stock). Would love to have 192 GB but I’m not sure I can justify buying another. Does anyone have a sense of how this might progress, e.g if I can get a 256 or 512 GB in a year if I wait. In any case I’m jealous this exists and…

On RAM supplies, the best estimates I've seen are https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-components/dram/cxmt-close-t... They are estimating a 25% shortfall in supply remaining in 2030, even with Chinese companies ramping up DDR5 supply. It's not looking great - the RAM producers need more of the same machines that other semi-conductor manufactures need and the suppliers of those seem unable to increase production.

> the RAM producers need more of the same machines that other semi-conductor manufactures need and the suppliers of those seem unable to increase production

I suspect that it is very, very profitable for them not to increase production and instead increase prices.

This is one of those cases where the free market fails and governments should step-in. IP laws are there to elevate the arts and sciences, not stifle them in the name of profit.

Re: New Framework Desktop Option with AMD Ryzen AI Max+ Pro 495 and 192GB Memory

#53
post #2

I have a framework desktop w/ 128GB that I bought last Christmas and if I’m looking at it right it costs $2000 (CAD) more now because of the RAM shortage (and in any event is apparently out of stock). Would love to have 192 GB but I’m not sure I can justify buying another. Does anyone have a sense of how this might progress, e.g if I can get a 256 or 512 GB in a year if I wait. In any case I’m jealous this exists and…

Are you generally happy with it? What do you mainly use it for? I'm kinda tempted by the frameworks because they are somewhat energy efficient and compact (which I both value highly!) but my concern is that the GPU is on the low end for 1440p gaming (while being barely price-competitive with a self-built Ryzen9950 + 9070XT combination).

Most games play just fine at 1440 or 4K with upscaling.

Cyberpunk ray tracing is a bad experience, but I just finished 007 First Light on ultra settings with an 5k monitor using FSR and it was 45+ fps the whole time. Targeting 4K with fsr was 60fps.

I’m not a hardcore gamer or a pro reviewer, but it mostly just works without having to change much. If I were a hardcore gamer I think I would go with a better setup.

My big complaint for gaming is that they never enabled HDMI CEC. Apparently the pins are wired but they never shipped the firmware.

Re: New Framework Desktop Option with AMD Ryzen AI Max+ Pro 495 and 192GB Memory

#56
post #47

I understand their reasoning but it’s still a shame Framework opted for a proprietary motherboard instead of mini-ITX with a socket CPU and GPU. I value repairability over a little bit of extra performance.

IIRC, Framework did ask AMD to explore a more repairable approach with socketable CPU and RAM for these chips and they did but came back and said it wouldn't perform well enough that way.

It's not really about performance, it's about signal integrity. AMD said that even with LPCAMM2, you just wouldn't be able to send a clean enough signal from all these different memory channels to the chip, and they insisted on a soldered design because they just couldn't make anything else work.

Technically it's not wrong to say it's about performance in the sense that if you clocked the RAM slow enough you probably could maintain signal integrity, but we're not talking some small hit to performance here, it'd probably be more like a multi-generational drop in memory bandwidth.

Re: New Framework Desktop Option with AMD Ryzen AI Max+ Pro 495 and 192GB Memory

#57

I typed my (masked) email into the input, pressed tab and enter, it redirected me to some cloudflare captcha marketing site. I thought at first it didn't want the masked email, but then it worked when I clicked with my mouse. Apparently there are 3 invisible focus targets in between! Dear people who create websites, these things are important, they should work!

You shouldn't need to tab first, right? Enter on an input field should submit the form unless they go out of their way to break it?

I think it works only on type text? I tab and enter out of habit, but to be fair, enter without tab works here. But then again (and many will feel I'm being nit-picky but you're just hearing from someone who had to conquer a lot of a11y audits at job, so just let me have different priorities), the whole node gets replaced without any announcement, Voiceover being left clueless about what happened. NVDA would probably be the same, but I'm on vacation and cannot test on windows right now.

This is a simple form, not a complicated thing, and it's the website of a company I love, so I'm paying extra attention perhaps.

Re: New Framework Desktop Option with AMD Ryzen AI Max+ Pro 495 and 192GB Memory

#58
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They did not, can you explain what do you mean?

For those of us with feebler minds than you or him, the name is just full of qualifiers that make no sense.

To expand, positional definition of adjectives tends to be a bad marketing scheme.

Nobody knows that pro and max mean specific things.

If AMD needs to create a full cross-product of their hardware feature set, because they intend to have a SKU for every possible combination, they probably need a better scheme.

Say what you want about Celeron/Pentium/i3/i5/i7, but it mostly got the idea across (except on the occasions Intel hijacked it to upbrand SKUs).

Re: New Framework Desktop Option with AMD Ryzen AI Max+ Pro 495 and 192GB Memory

#59

I understand their reasoning but it’s still a shame Framework opted for a proprietary motherboard instead of mini-ITX with a socket CPU and GPU. I value repairability over a little bit of extra performance.

There is no socketable Unified Memory platform. The entire point of this SoC is that it has Unified Memory. The Framework Desktop has a Mini-ITX board, but you MUST use a solderable SoC with HBM stacked memory to get a Unified Memory outcome. For local AI workloads, that's the only part that matters, which is the entire point of wanting 192GB of RAM available on an APU.

I like the repairability and modularity of my Framework 13 laptop, and I still bought a maxed out MBP M5 Max because for local LLM, unified memory is all that matters.

Re: New Framework Desktop Option with AMD Ryzen AI Max+ Pro 495 and 192GB Memory

#60
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use exactly the setup you describe; it can handle 1-3 agents working if the agent work has IO delays. with MTP models, prefill is quite fast. Not sure what damage you have, but no one waits 40 minutes per prompt or even a minute; The A3B model loads within 10 seconds and a simple response in opencode is maybe at most a minute, then catches up in 3-5second bursts depending on IO. I put dynamic context pruning into o…

Are you on Strix Halo? If so, which llama.cpp backend are you using? ROCm on Strix Halo still seems incompatible with MTP models.

yes. I build a docker file from this: https://github.com/kyuz0/amd-strix-halo-toolboxes

It has all the backends you want. Just a script rebuilds it. Then I just put it in a docker compose and whenever we want to update it, we pull the repo and rebuild it.

I just a models.ini like: version = 1 ``` [*] n-gpu-layers = 999 threads = 28 flash-attn = on mlock = off mmap = off fit = off warmup = on jinja = true direct-io = on cache-prompt = true cache-reuse = 256 models-max = 1 models-autoload = 1 timeout = 600 ctx-checkpoints = 256 cache-ram = 0 mlock = on kv-unified = on no-context-shift = on swa-full = on

[Q36-35B-A3B] model = Qwen3.6-35B-A3B-UD-Q8_K_XL.gguf mmproj = mmproj-BF16.gguf rope-scaling = yarn rope-scale = 1.14441 yarn-orig-ctx = 262144 override-kv = qwen35.context_length=int:1000000 ctx-size = 300000 reasoning = auto reasoning-budget = 421 reasoning-budget-message = you're reasoning too much; compress context and use subagents to investigate further spec-type = draft-mtp spec-draft-n-max = 3 batch-size = 16001 ubatch-size = 16001 cache-idle-slots = on temp = 0.6 top-p = 0.95 min-p = 0.00 top-k = 20 repeat-penalty = 1.1 presence-penalty = 0.0 ```

Using subagents, you keep the context size from bloating, and add tooling for the context compaction and it can keep looping. You probably want to clean up opencode's agent; back in the "Prompt Engineering" days there's a lot of unnecessary fluff. The goal of a prompt should be to get the model in the correct starting place, and not, try to give it everything it ever needs to do what you want it to do.

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