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Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

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Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#531

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would argue that if someone can't safely operate a vehicle without this then maybe they shouldn't have a license

In this scenario anyone who "should" have their license would never trigger this warning in the first place so it wouldn't be an issue.

In a well implemented system that accounted for every edge case, sure. The systems are not there yet.

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#532

All new cars. At this point I don't know if I'd buy anything made after 2008. Whenever I rent a new car around here (in the EU) I find them very annoying. The worst is the cruise control that tries to stick to the speed limit -- but its sensors don't always read the signs very well, so you'll often slow to 50 km/h (about 30 mph) for no reason. Then there's the incessant beeping at you, "lane assist" that you can't tu…

> Then there's the incessant beeping at you As a Canadian that did a road trip through the balkans over the winter, the rental car was constantly beeping at me for something. It was misreading signs and due to the bad weather (it was during a huge snowstorm in January) the roads weren't very clear and it was constantly confused. I also had some very unhappy drivers (especially in Albania) furiously trying to get arou…

I moved to Bulgaria last year, and while I love the country and its... rugged and quaint people, let me assure you, tarnishing their driver's reputation is impossible.

On an unrelated note, studying Bulgarian brought me a lot of joy.

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#533

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After seeing kia evs and having a Tesla. Its the only good EV brand because the software from everywhere else is a complete joke. Kia will tell me my doors are unlocked when I'm at home. Tesla has a set home feature. Plus the 50 other annoyances. Regen doesn't even persist with kia. You have to press the paddle to add it every time you start the car. All this to say, the only good ux car anymore is tesla. Too bad the…

Sigh, I’m so afraid you’re right, since I don’t want to buy a Tesla for values reasons. I wonder if Rivian will be competitive on the software front?

if it makes you feel better you are supporting American automakers and American workers when you buy tesla - has helped a lot of people swallow the musk pill when buying one

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#535
post #136

New cars are UX nightmares. I'm driving an electric Toyota bz4x. Lovely mechanics, but the general UX (some are because of Android Auto) is terrible. The remote's lock/unlock don't do anything when the car is on. Example: I'm by the trunk and it won't open unless I go back to the driver's door and unlock the doors. App's remote function has too many conditions to do anything. For instance, I'm resting in the back sea…

New Teslas are not a UX nightmare... go test drive a Kia, Hyundai, Toyota, GM, etc, then lastly a Tesla. Come back and tell me which car has the best software.

2026 hyundai is fine but is nothing special. Hyundai kona actually has an insane amount of physical buttons, around 50

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#536
post #534

When FSD actually works 100% (or as close as possible), manual driving will become obsolete, we're 5-10 years away. how long until a steering wheel is an optional extra?

Yeah we were 5-10 years away from full self driving 15 years ago too.

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#537

Boeing found out the problem with "beeping" alarms. The first time they installed a warning horn, I think it was the stall warning, it was a big success. So, they started adding different horns for other situations. At one point, in an emergency, the pilot got confused about which horn meant what, and had an accident. So now, Boeing replaced horns with a voice, like "pull up". Sounds obvious, right? But car beeps gen…

My parents’ ‘80s Chrysler New Yorker would talk instead of beep. ‘A door is ajar,” it would say, and we would giggle, ‘no, a door is a door!’ After Kitt in Nightrider, car companies wanted to be cool.

https://youtube.com/shorts/IhSrmB2qCdY?is=vg47_htvXpXS2ElU

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#538

Earlier quoted context omitted.

English is the universal aviation language. In other contexts there is no such language, and I can see how the politics of which and how many languages we should include in our car messages may well result in a "let's just use beeps" decision.

They have to supply written documentation in an appropriate language too, I don’t think it would be that difficult for it to have a voice language pack to match.

You're talking about an industry that gives you a generic "check engine" light and allows dealerships to charge you $100 just to read you the error message.

I don't have any faith that they have the wherewithal to make any common sense design choices about error states.

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#539

Ford has had that since Blue Cruise 2.0, or thereabouts. It really shocked me how often it catches my attention being diverted. Things like talking to my passengers, adjusting the climate controls, or eating- I'm not even talking about 'advanced distractions' like my phone. It also seemed really accurate. I never remember it beeping at me when I was actually paying attention. It's totally plausible to me that this ki…

But killing innocent bystanders is freedom!

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#540
post #200

All new cars. At this point I don't know if I'd buy anything made after 2008. Whenever I rent a new car around here (in the EU) I find them very annoying. The worst is the cruise control that tries to stick to the speed limit -- but its sensors don't always read the signs very well, so you'll often slow to 50 km/h (about 30 mph) for no reason. Then there's the incessant beeping at you, "lane assist" that you can't tu…

It BS article, no cameras pointed at your face are required. They require "Advanced Driver Distraction Warning System", don't specify how it should be implemented. Here's the text describing the system: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/eli/reg_del/2023/2590/oj/eng It specifically mentions that it is illegal to use the cameras from such system to identify the person. It is pretty much the opposite of what people think its go…

The text you linked mandates, as the first technical requirement, "An ADDW system shall determine when the driver’s visual attention is not directed towards the driving tasks and alert the driver through the vehicle human–machine interface."

Can you describe how you believe the driver's visual attention can be tracked by anything other than a camera pointed at the driver's face?

If no such other system exists, how is this doing anything other than mandating cameras pointed at the driver?

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