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Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

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Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#411

Post by rpdillon »

mrtksn wrote: post #200
A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #6

All new cars. At this point I don't know if I'd buy anything made after 2008. Whenever I rent a new car around here (in the EU) I find them very annoying. The worst is the cruise control that tries to stick to the speed limit -- but its sensors don't always read the signs very well, so you'll often slow to 50 km/h (about 30 mph) for no reason. Then there's the incessant beeping at you, "lane assist" that you can't tu…

It BS article, no cameras pointed at your face are required. They require "Advanced Driver Distraction Warning System", don't specify how it should be implemented. Here's the text describing the system: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/eli/reg_del/2023/2590/oj/eng It specifically mentions that it is illegal to use the cameras from such system to identify the person. It is pretty much the opposite of what people think its go…

It's like we live in different worlds. The entire arc of technology over the past 30 years has been to centralize, collect, and then monetize. There are tons of systems that shouldn't be doing that, but they all evolve to end up doing that. We need a new version of Zawinski's Law: every company will attempt to monetize until they're selling user data.

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#412

Post by jstsch »

Schiendelman wrote: post #18
jstsch wrote: post #3

The regulations are great, in theory. In practice, I've noticed that implementation of the technologies are lacking. So on paper, lane keeping will keep you on the road when distracted. In practice, it does not. You'll be beeped at a million times, though.

My Tesla is quite accurate about whether I'm looking at the road or not. What car specifically had this issue?

Two Toyotas. The steering you apply, even with almost no torque, always overrides lane keeping. Super dangerous. No beeps when that happens. Whereas with my Tesla you’d have to force it out of autopilot. Or fight a bit back if the car corrects you for safety.

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#413

Post by Gigachad »

deejaaymac wrote: post #286
awakeasleep wrote: post #9

Ford has had that since Blue Cruise 2.0, or thereabouts. It really shocked me how often it catches my attention being diverted. Things like talking to my passengers, adjusting the climate controls, or eating- I'm not even talking about 'advanced distractions' like my phone. It also seemed really accurate. I never remember it beeping at me when I was actually paying attention. It's totally plausible to me that this ki…

I would argue that if someone can't safely operate a vehicle without this then maybe they shouldn't have a license

In this scenario anyone who "should" have their license would never trigger this warning in the first place so it wouldn't be an issue.

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#414

Post by anonymousiam »

BeetleB wrote: post #258

I love the warning about not having hands on the steering wheel. It goes off all the time. And each time, my hands are on the steering wheel. It doesn't actually detect contact - it checks to see if you're actively adjusting the steering wheel. Except I don't need to! The lane keep assist is so good that it's rare I have to give it additional help. So - I kid you not - I've gotten used to giving a nudge to the steeri…

I have the same issue in my 2020 AMG. With lane assit on, the way it detects that your hands are on the steering wheel is by sensing your inputs to counter its inputs to the steering wheel position. It even seems to deliberately steer you off the center of the lane to see if you react.

That is a seriously broken control system. It should be keeping you in the center of the lane and not make you fight against the car.

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#415

Post by usui »

dlcarrier wrote: post #197
aljgz wrote: post #136

New cars are UX nightmares. I'm driving an electric Toyota bz4x. Lovely mechanics, but the general UX (some are because of Android Auto) is terrible. The remote's lock/unlock don't do anything when the car is on. Example: I'm by the trunk and it won't open unless I go back to the driver's door and unlock the doors. App's remote function has too many conditions to do anything. For instance, I'm resting in the back sea…

You mean the bZ4X. It wasn't enough that the name is incomprehensible, they also capitalized it incomprehensibly. I think the primary goal of that car was to see how few they could sell, so they could go back to hybrid and hydrogen.

Why are car companies other than Tesla and BYD so dumb with their EV naming strategy, but perfectly fine at naming gasoline cars? Really curious because it seems like you have to put in effort to be this silly at naming. Reminds me of how Microsoft names anything.

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#416

Post by pyridines »

aljgz wrote: post #136

New cars are UX nightmares. I'm driving an electric Toyota bz4x. Lovely mechanics, but the general UX (some are because of Android Auto) is terrible. The remote's lock/unlock don't do anything when the car is on. Example: I'm by the trunk and it won't open unless I go back to the driver's door and unlock the doors. App's remote function has too many conditions to do anything. For instance, I'm resting in the back sea…

What I hate about my new Toyota's volume knob is that there is no indication of volume level in the UI, and the knob itself doesn't ratchet. So I have absolutely no feedback about how much louder or quieter it's going to get when I turn the knob. If I have no music going, but I'm waiting to hear the next GPS instructions, how can I make sure I'm going to hear them? If I'm not sure where the volume is at right now, I can't, unless I turn it and then try and trigger some sound effect or something. It's needlessly complicated.

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#417

Post by Scoundreller »

Spooky23 wrote: post #147
frollogaston wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article is about the EU, but since you brought up US emissions testing... I live in California, only drive mid 2000s cars, and haven't noticed any of the restrictions getting tighter. It's the usual check every 2 years at the same place. Seems my cars are grandfathered into old emissions standards too. And yeah I enjoy having my car shut the hell up and let me drive.

I’m imagine that’s coming soon. Most new large cars are getting turbos now to meet federal and state standards, the turbos wear faster and I’m sure there will be a desire to validate them.

Now that my vehicle is approaching 20 years old, I’m so so so happy it has more interior comfort upgrades rather than mechanical ones like 4wd or a turbo.

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#418

Post by jazzyjackson »

jongjong wrote: post #355
Reason077 wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience (Tesla), attention monitoring works well even when I'm wearing sunglasses. The camera can still see my eyes even through dark polarised lenses. It may depend on the sunglasses, however - other people report problems with sunglasses that have mirrored lenses etc.

It's a matter of time before someone invents sunglasses with eyes painted on the lenses.

https://holographer.com/product/hologram-eye-sunglasses/

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#419

Post by mrtksn »

rpdillon wrote: post #411
mrtksn wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It BS article, no cameras pointed at your face are required. They require "Advanced Driver Distraction Warning System", don't specify how it should be implemented. Here's the text describing the system: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/eli/reg_del/2023/2590/oj/eng It specifically mentions that it is illegal to use the cameras from such system to identify the person. It is pretty much the opposite of what people think its go…

It's like we live in different worlds. The entire arc of technology over the past 30 years has been to centralize, collect, and then monetize. There are tons of systems that shouldn't be doing that, but they all evolve to end up doing that. We need a new version of Zawinski's Law: every company will attempt to monetize until they're selling user data.

That's literally why we have GDPR. This will be very illegal and the law itself specifically bans user identification with camera on top of the stuff protected by GDPR.

Re: Every new car sold in the European Union must include a driver monitoring camera

#420

Post by numitus »

A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #6

All new cars. At this point I don't know if I'd buy anything made after 2008. Whenever I rent a new car around here (in the EU) I find them very annoying. The worst is the cruise control that tries to stick to the speed limit -- but its sensors don't always read the signs very well, so you'll often slow to 50 km/h (about 30 mph) for no reason. Then there's the incessant beeping at you, "lane assist" that you can't tu…

automatic speed control in the Toyota Yaris works absolutely terribly. On the highway, it constantly misreads signs and suggests driving at 40 km/h instead of 120 km/h. It can even interpret a 10-ton weight limit sign as a 10 km/h speed limit!

And you can't turn off the audio warning, so I've just gotten used to it and now I ignore it.

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