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Sony erases digital content from libraries

arstechnica.com

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Re: Sony erases digital content from libraries

#71

Post by brazzy »

mapontosevenths wrote: post #27
cryo32 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find DVDs mostly pointless now. I've started seeing some from around 2000 which are now unplayable.

DVD was made with organic dyes that are susceptible to disc rot. For a brief time some cheap blu rays were as well. Now though all blu rays are inorganic and should last about 100 years. Some can last closer to 1000 years.

No, that's missing a crucial distinction. Writable CDs and DVDs used to be made with organic dyes, and yes, with BD-R the new LTH technology is inorganic and probably longer lasting.

But read-only media has always been pressed and then vacuum coated with aluminum. No dyes.

And the main component for both is always polycarbonate, which is organic, and probably won't last 100 years. There were some problems with early DVDs where the polycarbonate was not sealed propery, which led to oxydization of the aluminum layer, that's probably what GP observed. And of course that can happen through degradation as well.

In theory, it's possible to make these discs from glass, which should indeed last thousands of years. I've even heard that some glass music CDs were made for Hifi enthusiasts in Japan.

Re: Sony erases digital content from libraries

#72

Post by ksec »

earth_tattoo wrote: post #52
ksec wrote: post #46

We have so many of these discussions on HN already. Buy vs Rent. Digital vs Physical Ownership, Privacy etc. Yes we all have an opinion on that. I am more interested in a physical media that can keep its data for 80+ years, 500GB+, half the size of credit card and cheap to manufacture. At the moment, and looking at the pipeline of tech. There are none.

Why so extreme constraints? Why does it have to be half the size of credit card? I a personal server with 64tb space (5x16tb hard drives in a raid5) for movies etc. Been running for 4 years no issue, and I hope to run it for another 50-60 years with occasional disk replacement.

I am not looking a NAS replacement or NAS storage of my digital files. I am looking for replacement of Blu-Ray.

Re: Sony erases digital content from libraries

#73

Post by ksec »

reaperducer wrote: post #54
earth_tattoo wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why so extreme constraints? Why does it have to be half the size of credit card? I a personal server with 64tb space (5x16tb hard drives in a raid5) for movies etc. Been running for 4 years no issue, and I hope to run it for another 50-60 years with occasional disk replacement.

Why so extreme constraints? Because he's not looking for a solution. He's looking for someone to argue with.

Not exactly sure what point you are trying to get across.

Re: Sony erases digital content from libraries

#75

Post by TFNA »

gosub100 wrote: post #41
TFNA wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is publishers who generate ebooks – often with poor quality control as has been well known for two decades now – and provide them to distributors. Sony is just one distributor for such publisher-generated ebooks. Sony was probably unaware of the errors in that one of its myriad inventory until a customer alerted them, and the most it could offer would be a refund. Obviously Sony has neither the right nor the compe…

A grocery store is just a distributor. Yet they are responsible for selling something that makes me sick.

That comparison is a stretch, and in any event, grocery stores in many jurisdictions are not held responsible for selling something that makes consumers sick due to the producer’s fault unless a recall has been announced and the store did not heed it.

Re: Sony erases digital content from libraries

#76

Post by MSFT_Edging »

antx wrote: post #34
MSFT_Edging wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Political reasons =/= actual bad actors. The person you're replying to made a case that a person with outsized influence is creating media to stir resentment for attention and your conclusion is "political reasons". The word "political" always ends up meaning "don't talk about reactionaries throwing rocks"

You're moving the goalpost. I get that many people view Vincent Bolloré as a bad guy. But him being a "far-right actor" or whatever that means doesn't excuse Sony's anti-consumer actions in the slightest, that's completely missing the point, and turning things political for no reason. And also a logical falacy.

I wasn't defending the sony action, more defending the take you replied to.

Re: Sony erases digital content from libraries

#78

Post by mapontosevenths »

brazzy wrote: post #71
mapontosevenths wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

DVD was made with organic dyes that are susceptible to disc rot. For a brief time some cheap blu rays were as well. Now though all blu rays are inorganic and should last about 100 years. Some can last closer to 1000 years.

No, that's missing a crucial distinction. Writable CDs and DVDs used to be made with organic dyes, and yes, with BD-R the new LTH technology is inorganic and probably longer lasting. But read-only media has always been pressed and then vacuum coated with aluminum. No dyes. And the main component for both is always polycarbonate, which is organic, and probably won't last 100 years. There were some problems with early…

Not all polycarbonate is created equally, or at least it wasn't in the past. M-discs, for example, are rated to 1,000 years. Most folks only seriously believe they'll be good for a few hundred at the outside, but they WERE tested at 85% humidity and temperatures up to 185 degrees for extended periods of time. That's not the same thing as aging, but it's a pretty good stand-in.

The funny thing is... The rumor is that M-disc and normal discs are basically the same now. They're made on the same line and labelled differently from what I've been told. I can't vouch for it, but it makes sense and I've seen some folks online posted various test results that seem to back that up. The fancy Japanese certified archival discs are the same way. They're made on the same lines, just maybe examined a bit more carefully before packing.

I hadn't heard about those glass discs! Very cool. Now I kind of want one.

Re: Sony erases digital content from libraries

#79

Post by terbo »

hinata08 wrote: post #64
terbo wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Idk and id check it out too, but French rap is dope too, no idea of the contents, sounds good

half of it is darkest dark punk roast, and sings about working in the drug dealing industry like it's shark tank, but to afford living in a wet flat with cockroaches while you have no future but to be killed or jailed before you turn 25 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73mlCqmupLo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z__d10yL48Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BugZjSBDNE8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jPoSUBONal8 https:/…

Nice nice nice. I have a playlist of good russian rap, now I think I should start a collection of general foreign rap because well yea, I'll edit it in a sec

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_fgypD0ODA8 - This album is more chill, I like 17 По району (My District) and 9 Оп, мусорок (Look out, cop)

Re: Sony erases digital content from libraries

#80

Post by ButlerianJihad »

Pingk wrote: post #21
ButlerianJihad wrote: post #3

They were never "purchases" and it's more that the terminology has been faulty and misleading, more so than the business model. The rank-and-file consumer wanted to believe that "purchasing" something was permanent, but the metaphor is leaky. If I purchase a table from Ikea, then I take the kit home, I assemble it, I store the table, I maintain the table, I clean the table, and I can keep the table around for as long…

Sony chose to use the words "purchase" and "buy" on their pages, and hide some sneaky text in the EULA that changes their definition to remove the implication of ownership. They know that using terms like "rent" or "lease indefinitely" would reduce their revenue, so they squirrel away legal gotchas that no one ever reads to cover their arse. It shouldn't be allowed. Just because something is legal doesn't make it eth…

This type of transaction under discussion is neither "renting" nor "leasing" and those are also inapt terms, and so that is why nobody chose to use them.
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