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Scientists find molecular-level evidence for two structures in liquid water

phys.org

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Re: Scientists find molecular-level evidence for two structures in liquid water

#41

Post by adrianN »

qsera wrote: post #34
pryce wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Homeopathic medicine is a discredited theoretical explanation for a phenomenon that empirical testing shows does not exist. For 'homeopathy' to be right, it would need the to become 'right' twice - first: new data would need to begin existing, and then second: the homeopathic mechanisms would need to become the most plausible explanation for that data

>empirical testing shows does not exist.. But what are the incentives of those who did those tests? That should be said in the same breath as you say "empirical testing/evidence".

Imagine the number of citations you could get for a solid double blind study that showed homeopathy to beat placebo. The only better impact I could imagine would be showing that climate change doesn’t actually exist.

Re: Scientists find molecular-level evidence for two structures in liquid water

#42

Post by BobbyTables2 »

OutOfHere wrote: post #25
jiggawatts wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Homeopathy is very literally the singular concept that more diluted medicine works better. Saying that “less diluted works better” is saying the diametric opposite of what Homeopathic “theory” does!

You're speaking of classical homeopathy, not practical observation. In practice there are many homeopathic products with varying dilutions, many of which have a meaningful amount of the substance, and therefore the distinct possibility of a biological effect.

Agree! Someone once told me that homeopathic doctors often put significant amounts of allopathic medicine in their “homeopathic” concoctions. Does wonders for effectiveness! Perpetuating the classical myth in this manner is also great for business!

Of course, there are also a number of cases where western “supplements” were caught containing actual prescription medicine, not just natural precursors or such. Same idea…

Re: Scientists find molecular-level evidence for two structures in liquid water

#43

Post by Alex3917 »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #22
aand16 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't know about right, but for a while it worked better than "regular" medicine. At least it wouldn't kill you, when the alternative was intensive bloodlettings and purgatives.

> for a while it worked better than "regular" medicine. At least it wouldn't kill you Homeopathy was invented after the discovery of germ theory [1][2]. So not really. And homeopathy has always suffered from an adulteration problem. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germ_theory_of_disease [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathy

> Homeopathy was invented after the discovery of germ theory [1][2]. So not really.

Germ Theory was only finally accepted (after initially being rejected) due to the advent of evidence-based medicine, which homeopathy popularized.

Re: Scientists find molecular-level evidence for two structures in liquid water

#44

Post by JumpCrisscross »

Alex3917 wrote: post #43
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> for a while it worked better than "regular" medicine. At least it wouldn't kill you Homeopathy was invented after the discovery of germ theory [1][2]. So not really. And homeopathy has always suffered from an adulteration problem. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germ_theory_of_disease [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathy

> Homeopathy was invented after the discovery of germ theory [1][2]. So not really. Germ Theory was only finally accepted (after initially being rejected) due to the advent of evidence-based medicine, which homeopathy popularized.

> due to the advent of evidence-based medicine, which homeopathy popularized

Source?

Re: Scientists find molecular-level evidence for two structures in liquid water

#45

Post by qsera »

adrianN wrote: post #41
qsera wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>empirical testing shows does not exist.. But what are the incentives of those who did those tests? That should be said in the same breath as you say "empirical testing/evidence".

Imagine the number of citations you could get for a solid double blind study that showed homeopathy to beat placebo. The only better impact I could imagine would be showing that climate change doesn’t actually exist.

Mmmm..the question is..who would fund it. And if someone funded it, who would publish it...

Re: Scientists find molecular-level evidence for two structures in liquid water

#46

Post by aljgz »

potatosalad99 wrote: post #5

So the OTA firmware updates on my dehumidifier for when they discover a new kind of water will come in handy after all!

Dehumidifiers will end up being more efficient in one mode. When the manufacturer creates the new ones, a firmware update moves all legacy devices to the less efficient mode.

Re: Scientists find molecular-level evidence for two structures in liquid water

#47

Post by bonesss »

aand16 wrote: post #17
harimau777 wrote: post #6

It would be hilarious if homeopathy turned out to be right! (To be clear, I don't think that will actually happen, but it would be hilarious if it did!)

Don't know about right, but for a while it worked better than "regular" medicine. At least it wouldn't kill you, when the alternative was intensive bloodlettings and purgatives.

As I recall homeopathy does pretty fine statistically compared to many treatments. Not because the water does anything, but because the provider has time, and talks to patients about their problems and life.

A lot of doctors are shoving people out the door based on their first thought inside a short appointment as they type up a prescription.

Homeopathy is ineffective kookery, but our medical system has some well known gaps.

Re: Scientists find molecular-level evidence for two structures in liquid water

#50

Post by antoniojtorres »

qsera wrote: post #45
adrianN wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine the number of citations you could get for a solid double blind study that showed homeopathy to beat placebo. The only better impact I could imagine would be showing that climate change doesn’t actually exist.

Mmmm..the question is..who would fund it. And if someone funded it, who would publish it...

Is this a bit? Please state your point clearly instead of conspiratorial innuendo.
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