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Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

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Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#631

Post by sixothree »

nullbio wrote: post #451
sixothree wrote: post #421

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What was your particular experience with it?

Hallucination city, doing whatever it feels like and far more than what I've bargained for, and performance on par with Opus 4.8 for coding in a large production codebase. I still have far more success with GPT 5.5, it actually follows my instructions and doesn't try to automate my entire job, which allows me to build skills and pipelines around the things I actually want automated.

Interesting. I only used Fable. And not for very much time. But one thing I did notice was improved adherence. Maybe it was just improved adherence to the claude.md and the instructions from the skills in use that I was noticing.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#632

Post by andsoitis »

softwaredoug wrote: post #559
derektank wrote: post #471

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wholeheartedly agree with what you’re saying in general. I do wonder though, given how rapid advancements in AI are occurring, if even an agency with statutory authority would be able to establish a predictable regulatory environment, let alone do so while maintaining a lengthy public comment period and a whole of government approach. There are obvious flaws with the current administration’s approach to, well, almo…

Nothing being talked about with Mythos wasn’t a known AI risk 12 months ago. Those rules could have been established to guide frontier labs. But yes crazy things happen. Maybe it won’t catch everything. The right answer are giving the govt / this agency explicit legal, short term model pause capabilities to let the rule making process happen if something completely out of band happens. Or let the agency study/approve…

> Nothing being talked about with Mythos wasn’t a known AI risk 12 months ago. Those rules could have been established to guide frontier labs.

Is there a jurisdiction that HAS created legislation or regulations that takes it into account? I would think that if it is super easy to foresee and formulate practical and effective regulations for AI, then it must already exist somewhere.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#633

Post by sixothree »

g42gregory wrote: post #470
sixothree wrote: post #420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's good. My brief exposure to it suggests it deserved a new product name.

I agree, I worked with it for a bit and it seemed better than Opus 4.8. One thing that I would like to try is Pi code agent. People seems to like it. GPT allows you to use it on subscription, but Anthropic cut that off on Max subscription. One more incentive to try something new. Also, I feel that I rely on Anthropic too much and none of these guys could be trusted. Next step -> foray into the Chinese models (admitte…

I've essentially had two subscriptions since last May (along with my use of local models for whisper, image processing, and toy experiments). And I'm about to do the same thing as you with my second account - chinese models.

I think that's important actually to have constant access to two so you can understand what their strengths are. Plus it's easier mentally to switch your alt account than your workhorse.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#634

Post by dwa3592 »

roncesvalles wrote: post #630
dwa3592 wrote: post #612

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the scale problem (both speed and access) with LLMs. Don't you think the barrier to entry for hacking has become lower with LLMs?

Not really. Firstly, speed and access are actually money problems. Secondly, motivated state actors have no dearth of money. It's not like the Chinese are saying "oh it would cost a bit too much to infiltrate all US financial systems, we'd have done it if it cost less." If it can be done, it would've already been done. No party that matters is materially "unblocked" by the advent of LLMs.

I think I disagree with your premise.

If china as a state wanted to do something nefarious they would just do it. They have no interest in hacking regular folk's bank accounts. It's the criminal rings (around the world) who are interested in doing so and LLMs (and other types of AI models) can 100% help them scale their operations. I built a voice cloning app last summer with GPT4.5. It needed 5 seconds of sample to clone someone's voice and it was shocking that it was possible. I showed it to my parents and we decided to have a code word in case of emergencies. I told them not to believe if anybody called and asked for money pretending it was me.

You'd be surprised how many senior citizens fall for these traps every year.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#635

Post by thayne »

carlossouza wrote: post #394
thayne wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only reason I can see is because Amazon wanted something like this to happen. But I'm not sure what Amazon would gain from that, since they don't have their own competing frontier models.

Of course, Amazon wanted this to happen. They own 20% of Anthropic. Anthropic bleeds cash. They have to raise capital. There are only 2 ways: an IPO or follow-ons from existing investors. If the IPO gets delayed because of these restrictions, Anthropic will be forced to raise more capital from existing investors. And existing investors (Amazon) will end up owning more of Anthropic at a cheaper valuation.

That assumes that this results in the IPO getting delayed long enough for Anthropic to need another private funding round, and that Anthropic won't be upset enough about this that they won't let Amazon invest more.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#636

Post by noelsusman »

felixgallo wrote: post #629
noelsusman wrote: post #627

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't say or even imply that OpenAI and Anthropic are equally bad on this front. It's just not accurate to say Anthropic has issues with the US military using Claude to commit war crimes. They don't.

They literally do -- see above, where the red line they refused to cross involved fully autonomous kill bots (which would be a war crime), and for which they were branded a supply chain risk, thrown out of Pentagon contracts, and now enjoined from releasing their product. You can not like that Claude was involved in the planning that led to the murder of a bunch of schoolgirls, but stop playing pretend.

It's just a fact that Claude has already been used to commit war crimes and Anthropic has had zero issue with it. I don't know what else there is to say about it.

Also, not that it really matters but building a fully autonomous kill bot is not actually a war crime.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#637

Post by lazide »

VikRubenfeld wrote: post #609
metalspot wrote: post #589

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How is this gloating? he is emphasizing that they used their own words against them. everyone knows the security threat is a pretext. the message is that he is smart and they are stupid and he won, which is what I call gloating. > "Those trying to misdirect and tie this action to the prior DoW/Anthropic issues are wrong." an obvious lie, which is inserted to emphasize that it is a lie. when you purposefully lie, no…

"everyone knows the security threat is a pretext." On what planet? Anthropic itself made a big stink about Mythos being able to hack every app out there, and very dangerous as a result. Many reports have confirmed this.

‘every app out there’ - bwahahaha

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#638

Post by zmmmmm »

ramraj07 wrote: post #414
zmmmmm wrote: post #269

The only thing I can think of that would give Amazon reasons to dislike Mythos / Fable is that Anthropic really ruined their Bedrock story by imposing data retention requirements that cross a red line in regulatory compliance. It's just possible that Jassy would rather have nobody use Fable than doing it on the basis of, effectively, a direct data trust relationship with Anthropic. It is hard to plug it together into…

Im just curious how this is going to play out.. Will anthropic just stop releasing its stuff on bedrock now? Will they try to start moving their operations out of the US? If so, to where? I know everyones excited about Football and the Knicks, but this is far more exciting and interesting than any sport could be.

it's pretty interesting in the sense that Amazon went far out of their way to build a secure process around this:

https://docs.aws.amazon.com/bedrock/latest/userguide/data-pr...

In theory, there currently isn't any technical mechanism for the retention Anthropic is requiring here to happen. Either Amazon is not being truthful (unlikely) or Anthropic is requiring them to significantly alter the architecture they have built around hosting of their models. But then doing so would put them in strict violation, I would imagine, of the commitments they have made to enterprises - many of which themselves are mandated into meeting these requirements by their own legal or regulatory requirements.

There are missing pieces I can't reconcile here - but one answer is simply that there aren't answers and that would be why Jassy is EXTREMELY pissed at Anthropic right now.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#639

Post by iknowstuff »

nativeit wrote: post #448
iknowstuff wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'll notice the tariffs were helping legacy auto more than Tesla

Or that the tariffs were ham-fisted, arbitrary, and lacking in rational justifications. I’m not sure one can draw too many firm conclusions from that particular “policy”.

No they were simply meant to help UWA workers.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#640

Post by Dylan16807 »

altairprime wrote: post #171
satvikpendem wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not supposed to be a gotcha, it's supposed to be an example of the hypocrisy of the government.

Bad choice of example, then. Restricting things that are uniquely and critical to planning and executing school shootings is a highly desirable outcome for regulation, in the eyes of a society that desires its youth to grow up without constant threat of murder at their mandatory educational institutions. That desire is not particularly uniform in the U.S. right now, in contrast with much of the world. Choosing murder…

> Restricting things that are uniquely and critical to planning and executing

Which it isn't.

I thought that was the point, that it's an excuse to "protect" in a way that doesn't actually protect.

In which case it's a good example.

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