Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Ultra-processed foods in the global food system: The role of tobacco companies

ajph.aphapublications.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

171–180 of 304 posts

Re: Ultra-processed foods in the global food system: The role of tobacco companies

#171

Post by data-ottawa »

Forgeties79 wrote: post #79
wossab wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And teeth. This stuff will do nasty things to your gums. And receded gums never recover.

Unless you do an incredibly painful graft right? I have a buddy who had to do that in college and man it seemed incredibly unpleasant. They harvested the skin from the roof of his mouth IIRC Edit: yikes sounds like it gets worse and might not even work

I had to do a graft and it wasn’t especially painful. I got painkillers but only used them on the first day.

The recovery period sucked, I needed antibiotics and couldn’t eat anything solid for two weeks.

If you can behaviourally prevent needing gum grafts you should.

Re: Ultra-processed foods in the global food system: The role of tobacco companies

#172

Post by embedding-shape »

throwaway173738 wrote: post #134
embedding-shape wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is your problem with them that they're synthetic, or that it's nicotine? Pouched tobacco like that been used for decades in some places in the world, or even without pouches, just making your own ball and sticking the tobacco under your lip. I'm not sure these countries have a higher rate of GI/gut problems than other places, which kind of would invalidate your entire argument here.

You customarily spit out that saliva that’s been in contact with your dip. Swallowing it is way worse for you. When I framed houses the guys that chewed would leave a little trail of brown spots everywhere.

> You customarily spit out that saliva that’s been in contact with your dip

I don't think this is necessarily true everywhere/for everyone, it's really not common in Sweden to walk around spitting just because you have tobacco under your lip, as people sit in offices and stuff with this in their mouth, can't really go around a spit indoors.

Re: Ultra-processed foods in the global food system: The role of tobacco companies

#173

Post by groundzeros2015 »

mapotofu wrote: post #15
breezybottom wrote: post #6

Ultra-processed is a meaningless word used to get media attention. The state of nutrition science is abysmal.

No it isn’t. The advice on nutrition is abundantly clear and has been for a long time: eat food, mostly plants, not too much. That science has pushed GRAS as “food” is abysmal. Lots of you have just been punked.

Why plants?

Re: Ultra-processed foods in the global food system: The role of tobacco companies

#174

Post by moritzwarhier »

cm2012 wrote: post #49
Hnrobert42 wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree in part. By definition, the conglomerates have many parts. Some of those are not objectively bad. I also agree that people have choices. I disagree that it is simply people choice it. When large corporations perform research to find hyperpalatable foods, spend billions on marketing, and capture regulatory apparatus to lock in their dominant position, it absolutely is that they are pushing it on people.

Those things you said sound evil but they're really not. Finding hyper-palatable food is just another word for finding stuff people want to eat if you're making food, something that's tasty. Spending billions on marketing? Marketing is how you connect to what customers want. I'm a professional marketer, right and it's really really hard. If I was trying to sell food, I'd try different positioning statements, differen…

Optimizing for food that costs the least in ingredients, at the same time is provenly unhealthy, and has addictive properties, is a totally valid strategy for a free market but it's far from "feeding the world".

And better accessibility of unhealthy food in comparison to healthy food is a reality for many people, especially when they cannot outsource the act of buying and preparing food to others, including family, or spend arbitrary amounts of money on luxury "health food".

I'm not saying it's impossible to buy healthy food, or the responsibility of regulation to dictate what people eat.

But what you say about marketing seems besides the point to me.

Optimizing marketing of food for profit is not equal to "feeding the world".

Re: Ultra-processed foods in the global food system: The role of tobacco companies

#175

Post by embedding-shape »

DanielHB wrote: post #115
embedding-shape wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is your problem with them that they're synthetic, or that it's nicotine? Pouched tobacco like that been used for decades in some places in the world, or even without pouches, just making your own ball and sticking the tobacco under your lip. I'm not sure these countries have a higher rate of GI/gut problems than other places, which kind of would invalidate your entire argument here.

Snus (tobacco pouches you put under your gums) is super popular in Sweden: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snus It is basically the same thing but not synthetic. Supposedly nicotin pouches are not as harmful because they do not have tobacco leaves. I am a bit ambivalent about it, on one hand people don't smoke as much because snus which means I don't get as much second hand smoke. On the other hand it is WAY easier for…

Exactly what I'm talking about, just didn't want to name it by name as people have a lot of preconceived notions about it that pops up as soon as you say "snus", for some reason.

Re: Ultra-processed foods in the global food system: The role of tobacco companies

#176

Post by dluan »

moduspol wrote: post #145
tornikeo wrote: post #73

Tobacco companies should've just announced that "This new tobacco we made is super good, but too dangerous to release, so we are smoking it ourselves and giving it to only the select C-level smokers"

I heard this new tobacco is a national security threat. You don't want China to be making it, do you?

Now China has invested heavily in their homegrown industry and all of their cigs are currently 10 years ahead of the rest of the world. Chunghwa thins are the new frontier, with their subtle plum aroma.

Re: Ultra-processed foods in the global food system: The role of tobacco companies

#177

Post by groundzeros2015 »

red-iron-pine wrote: post #72
4rtem wrote: post #45

What's so wrong to produce snacks and canned fruits?

"snacks" is so broad of a term as to be useless for discussion dried bananas chips as a snack? fine. potato chips cooked mostly in palm oil? not so great. both "snacks"

Why? What’s better? I see only branding differences.

Re: Ultra-processed foods in the global food system: The role of tobacco companies

#178

Post by margalabargala »

breezybottom wrote: post #138
margalabargala wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't, so there's something you're correct about! But certainly pro-processed-foods stuff gets pushed by the right, and Soros is on the left, so there's the contradiction.

Huh? You're on the side of RFK Jr and the MAHA nutjobs. This is the kind of "science" they believe in.

Sometimes among large groups of people there are varying opinions, you'll see this more as you grow up. The american right wing is one such group.

Re: Ultra-processed foods in the global food system: The role of tobacco companies

#179

Post by gwbas1c »

v64 wrote: post #144
gwbas1c wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problems with chewing tobacco are well-known. BTW, colon cancer is rising among men in their 40s, and there is no known reason why.

Those problems are because of the tobacco. Zyn packets et al are just nicotine, and nicotine itself has not been shown to be a carcinogen.

At this point, I wouldn't assume that any nicotine delivery system is safe.

IE, e-cigarettes used to be promoted as safe, until the popcorn lung incident: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bronchiolitis_obliterans#E-cig... (TLDR, some e-cigarettes used diacetyl as a flavoring, which is safe to eat but very toxic to inhale.)

(Kinda stinks because nicotine is a cool drug.)

Re: Ultra-processed foods in the global food system: The role of tobacco companies

#180

Post by nickserv »

9rx wrote: post #132
nickserv wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's absolutely not a meaningless term, it's a classification in the Nova standard: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nova_classification And regarding health risks, please ask your doctor about your consumption. You may be surprised.

It is meaningless to the general population. No term is meaningless to an individual or small groups of people, obviously. That goes without saying.

By that logic all sorts of technical and scientific terms would be "meaningless".

Seems like playing semantics, to not say disingenuous, using "meaningless" to mean "unknown", when the former clearly has a negative connotation.

Post reply on HN