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Poland is now among the 20 largest economies

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Re: Poland is now among the 20 largest economies

#761

I love the polish, but credit where credit is due: „Poland is the largest beneficiary of EU funds 2014-2020, with one in four euro going to Poland“ https://www.gov.pl/web/funds-regional-policy/poland-at-the-f... Update: The comments below this are strange. I ment: „Poland gets money, Poland transforms it into more money”. Is Poland more efficient in it than other countries? I do not know. Would Poland have generated…

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Re: Poland is now among the 20 largest economies

#762
post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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I’m not interested in debating the anti-Islam diatribe. If your lived experience is that “bearded men and veiled women” have destroyed the halcyon paradise of your childhood, then that’s fundamentally a nostalgia-based emotional argument. But I’ll clarify that I wrote that Spain, Portugal and Greece specifically have become dynamic economies in the context of the EU. Spain has grown at a consistent 3% for a decade. O…

It's not a nostalgia-based emotional argument. It's real:

Half of the middle-schoolers in Vienna (Austria's capital) are now muslim:

https://www.heute.at/s/494-der-kinder-an-wiens-mittelschulen...

In France the DZ (Algerian) mafia is powerful enough to violently intimidate prison personnel and attack prisons:

https://www.latribune.fr/la-tribune-dimanche/societe/attaque...

In Netherlands, "Mokro" (Moroccan) mafia forced the heir to leave the country, after putting a price on her head.

https://www.wsj.com/world/europe/europe-drugs-gangs-organize...

So yeah, I guess that some locals can not commune together with you about the immense benefits unrestrained immigration brings to their countries.

Re: Poland is now among the 20 largest economies

#763

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The bearded men have increased the crime rates in Spain, France, UK, Germany, Sweden etc. This is crystal clear if you look up statistics. Just in the last week there was a Aloha Snack Bar stabbing in Barcelona. Poland has low crime rates specifically because they have strict border controls. You are free to personally visit Brussels to see what a shit hole it is.

Exactly how do you believe their borders are more strict given that they’re in Schengen? And how is the EU to blame for Belgium’s immigration policies but not Poland’s?

Schengen allows for border control. Germany has quite strong ones nowadays due to the illegal migrant influx.

Re: Poland is now among the 20 largest economies

#764
post #496

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 2. No east-west dithering - PL knew right away to which economic and cultural sphere wanted to belong I wonder how much the Catholic vs. Orthodox background affected things there

Not much I think. I had long discussions about it with my Ukrainian friends: we came to the conclusion that it was mostly the fact that Ukraine was part of the USSR (much harder crackdowns on opposition, actually including the church) - and that also built stronger ties with Russia. A lot of people forget that USSR really was a multicultural empire: you had families where in the 90s siblings abruptly woke up in diffe…

> Post-2022 some of those families stopped talking to each other, the propaganda is stronger than the family ties.

I don't think it's a matter of propaganda. We're talking about totalitarian dictatorships on both sides of the barricades, where such communication with relatives on the other side have very real risks of decades in prison or even death.

Re: Poland is now among the 20 largest economies

#765
post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the 1980s, EU money was flowing to Spain, Portugal and Greece. And people complained about that too. But the result is inarguably positive. Those countries had only recently become democracies after decades of military dictatorships or otherwise unstable third-world style governments. Today they're the most dynamic economies in the EU in many respects, and their democracies are well established and functioning. Th…

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Re: Poland is now among the 20 largest economies

#766

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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>Many americans suffer from this I'm a Ukrainian-American who's lived in Ukraine, Poland, and the US; have property/bank accounts in all three countries, and speak three languages and Russian. The "Americans suffering from this" would be people saying what you just did. Please read my other comment up the thread where I provide more context. And please don't presume you have any idea on how others view the world. >Th…

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Re: Poland is now among the 20 largest economies

#767

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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>Ehhh, because only MAGA complains No. Because Russia has specifically invested in propaganda efforts influencing rural voters in Poland to support Polish far-right parties (and PiS), using it to foster anti-EU and anti-Ukraine sentiment. The Polish farmers blocking the border checkpoints used for delivery of military aid to Ukraine a few years ago as "ptotest" was a mirror image tactic of the Canadian conservative t…

You seem to assume that I'm an American? I'm not, nor do I live in the Americas. You're not an American either but for some reason you seem to have taken over an awful lot of the "democratic" viewpoints. Those viewpoints are quite polarising whether you see this or not and they're largely based around the "democratic" attempt to gain the upper hand in American elections by creating an "us versus them" narrative in which everyone who does not abide to a desired narrative is part of, in collusion with or influenced by "them". You insist I don't tell me what to do when I call out your reference to 'MAGA' in a thread around Poland being a growing economy but in the same post you tell me to 'revert my downvote' (what downvote? I do not vote down, I discuss) and that I should 'learn'. Well, I learn all the time and from your discourse I learned that you seem to have taken a rather polarised position when it comes to American affairs which seems to come straight out of the "democrat" playbook. You also infer that those who do not agree with your position on these subjects must be "influenced by Russian disinformation campaigns". Let me put a few things straight:

- as said I'm not an American

- ...and I do not want the extremely polarised political discourse from the U.S.A. to be exported more than it already is...

- ...so I disagree with the application of the 'MAGA' moniker to the current discourse on the Polish economy...

- ...nor do I see the "democratic" party as the "good" side versus the "bad" republicans or - if you dislike the d/r dichotomy the "non-MAGA" versus "MAGA". The "democrats" accuse the republicans of what they've been doing during the Obama and Biden regimes while the republicans accuse(d) the "democrats" of what they were doing during the Bush and Trump regimes. Pot, meet kettle. The result of all those shenanigans is that the populace got fed up with all the politicking and voted for a candidate who came from outside the political circus: Trump. This did not stop the politicking, it only made it worse so they voted for him again, and again. I suspect they'll keep on voting for candidates like him until they're fed up with the constant turmoil and vote for a "boring" candidate. I say let them, it is their country, we have our own share of problems here.

- With regard to the Russian invasion of Ukraine I'd like to see Putin pushed back over the original borders...

- ...but I also realise that Ukraine had and has its own share of problems with corruption so the country has quite a way to go once Putin (or whoever succeeds him once he happened to fall out of a window in his underground bunker) has been put in his place...

Now let's get back to discussing the Polish "wirtschaftswunder" - there'll be a better Polish term for that - and keep American politics where it belongs, in the U.S.A.

Re: Poland is now among the 20 largest economies

#768
post #430

I love the polish, but credit where credit is due: „Poland is the largest beneficiary of EU funds 2014-2020, with one in four euro going to Poland“ https://www.gov.pl/web/funds-regional-policy/poland-at-the-f... Update: The comments below this are strange. I ment: „Poland gets money, Poland transforms it into more money”. Is Poland more efficient in it than other countries? I do not know. Would Poland have generated…

> I love the polish, but credit where credit is due > I ment: „Poland gets money, Poland transforms it into more money”. I have noticed that absolutely every time Poland's success is mentioned, someone from EU steps in to downplay it. A self-serving bias. Seriously, that type of comment is absolutely everywhere. Any YouTube video. Any Reddit post. In last couple days I have seen it about dozen times, last time today…

Poles have also the lowest tfr of the EU. This growth comes at a cost : the future.

Re: Poland is now among the 20 largest economies

#769

The story is longer: Poland was the first country to make a remarkable peaceful transition from a bankrupt, failed Soviet satellite state. The shock therapy, plus NATO and EU aspirations, paved the way. It is a story of a country that made a lot of the right decisions along the way. Managed to keep consistent high growth, not a pony trick or boom/bust mode. Poland should be a role model for many other countries. Reco…

Why wouldn't the story be that they succeeded despite the shock therapy? Honestly asking, I am not an expert on Polish economy, but I heard bad things. Maybe all of those hardworking people could have done even better with a different macro strategy?

The rapid and successful conversion to market economy was the main reason we are where we are. Human cost was extremely high, crime went up quickly and lots of money was lost. I'd argue this was corrected by joining EU and by adjusting the plan to polish reality.

What made it a success was also the social capital in Poland, a lot of people worked extremely hard to pull it off, but still high unemployment was alleviated only by joining EU and people leaving to find employment elsewhere

Re: Poland is now among the 20 largest economies

#770

I love the polish, but credit where credit is due: „Poland is the largest beneficiary of EU funds 2014-2020, with one in four euro going to Poland“ https://www.gov.pl/web/funds-regional-policy/poland-at-the-f... Update: The comments below this are strange. I ment: „Poland gets money, Poland transforms it into more money”. Is Poland more efficient in it than other countries? I do not know. Would Poland have generated…

The Baltics and the Balkan states probably get just as many handouts as Poland, and still show lesser rate of economic growth.

Institutions aside, Poland is well placed geographically to be a manufacturing hub for Germany and the rest of Europe. You can't do that in Baltics or the Balkans.
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