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FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

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Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#121

Post by doomslayer999 »

observationist wrote: post #50
anonymars wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if we can still buy burner phones for cash at Mondo Mart

Differential identification means you can be singled out based on profiles. Even if you don't have any accounts, big tech companies still have shadow profiles, and those shadow profiles can be linked to your offline identity, such that everything you've done that's been recorded, and everything you've done in (temporal, physical, or digital) proximity to other people who do have accounts results in a record of activi…

[dead]

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#122

Post by autoexec »

robotnikman wrote: post #84
samrus wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the pipeline needs to be plugged at both ends. We shouldnt allow this data to be sold without express consent. And we shouldnt allow the government to purchase this sort of data regardless of consent, protected under the 4th amendment. unless, iguess, express consent is given to be used by the government for investigative purposes, which no one would give since they dont have to under the 5th amendment

I think the user should be paid for the data that is being gathered up. If we want a source of UBI for the future where AI is replacing every job, well here is a potential source to fund it.

dynamic/discriminatory pricing driven by AI leveraging all this data would just ensure that any money people got from UBI was funneled into the pockets of corporations anyway.

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#123

Post by lmeyerov »

Tempest1981 wrote: post #117
lmeyerov wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple and Google are facilitating the data sales Specifically, these big companies revenue share with app companies who in turn increase monetization via selling your private information, esp via free apps. In exchange for Apple etc super high app store rake percentage fees, they claim to run security vetting programs and ToS that vet who they do business with and tell users & courts that things are safe, even when t…

Not Experian, TransUnion, and Equifax? Or for location, the cellular providers?

There are plenty of bad actors

The interesting part is Google & Apple, as part of explaining to courts why their large app store fees are legit and not proof of monopoly positions, hid behind the security argument that they need to be the clearing house of what software runs on the devices. Except... they've knowingly punted on this one for 10+ years.

I would 100% agree that losing privacy through any utility-level carrier (credit cards, phone, OS provider, etc) should be default disallowed, and any opt-ins have a clear transparency mode with easy opt-out. At least two areas the US can learn from the EU on digital policy is digital marketplaces and consumer privacy protection, and this topic is at the intersection of both.

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#124

Post by autoexec »

cheriot wrote: post #107
lmeyerov wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple and Google are facilitating the data sales Specifically, these big companies revenue share with app companies who in turn increase monetization via selling your private information, esp via free apps. In exchange for Apple etc super high app store rake percentage fees, they claim to run security vetting programs and ToS that vet who they do business with and tell users & courts that things are safe, even when t…

I'm game for throwing rocks at Apple and Google, but I don't get this one. > consumer apps embed ad SDKs → those SDKs feed location signals into RTB ad exchanges → surveillance-oriented firms sit in the RTB pipeline and harvest bid request data even without winning auctions Would you ban ad supported apps? Assuming the comment you're responding to is realistic, I'm not sure how the OS is to blame.

> Would you ban ad supported apps?

There's no need to ban ad supported apps when you can just ban the practice of using ads targeting users based on individual characteristics.

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#125

Post by autoexec »

quantified wrote: post #90
lmeyerov wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple and Google are facilitating the data sales Specifically, these big companies revenue share with app companies who in turn increase monetization via selling your private information, esp via free apps. In exchange for Apple etc super high app store rake percentage fees, they claim to run security vetting programs and ToS that vet who they do business with and tell users & courts that things are safe, even when t…

And Facebook/Meta. Their trackers are everywhere.

cloudflare is more everywhere than facebook

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#126

Post by hedora »

cheriot wrote: post #107
lmeyerov wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple and Google are facilitating the data sales Specifically, these big companies revenue share with app companies who in turn increase monetization via selling your private information, esp via free apps. In exchange for Apple etc super high app store rake percentage fees, they claim to run security vetting programs and ToS that vet who they do business with and tell users & courts that things are safe, even when t…

I'm game for throwing rocks at Apple and Google, but I don't get this one. > consumer apps embed ad SDKs → those SDKs feed location signals into RTB ad exchanges → surveillance-oriented firms sit in the RTB pipeline and harvest bid request data even without winning auctions Would you ban ad supported apps? Assuming the comment you're responding to is realistic, I'm not sure how the OS is to blame.

Apple supposedly does this with the privacy report cards.

However, I'd be shocked if a cursory audit comparing SDKs embedded in apps and disclosed data sales showed they were effectively enforcing anything at all.

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#127

Post by deathanatos »

paulryanrogers wrote: post #114

Isn't this is just a naked reach around the 4th amendment?!

Yes. But AFAIK, not an unconstitutional one. Wyden agrees with you:

> Wyden said buying information on Americans without obtaining a warrant was an “outrageous end-run around the Fourth Amendment,”

America needs privacy laws for this reason (or an amendment, but good luck). Vote when November rolls around; the other piece is finding Democrats that will take an actual stance on privacy closer to Wyden's.

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#128

Post by autoexec »

dylan604 wrote: post #105
wittyusername wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find myself uninstalling every app unless I really need it and use it. It's amazing how many apps just sit around in your life over time. get them off your phone

The greatest part of reading HN is finding out that my distrust of apps and their developers is not weird. It does make me question my abilities as a dev for refusing to partake in these reindeer games. Clearly, I am not the right type of person to do well in big tech.

The problem is that it is weird. It's the smart/right thing to do, but countless people mindlessly install whatever they're told to install or whatever looks fun. We hand mobile devices over to children who have no idea why they shouldn't, but honestly many adults are just as ignorant and trusting.

Most people I've spoken with are either thinking "Apple/Google/Government would never allow apps to do something like that!" or they think "Everyone is already doing it so why bother trying to fight it. I'd only be inconveniencing myself for nothing"

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#129

Post by hedora »

autoexec wrote: post #125
quantified wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And Facebook/Meta. Their trackers are everywhere.

cloudflare is more everywhere than facebook

Yeah, but unlike facebook, they weren't just caught making videos of people having sex then paying people to watch the videos.

Also, unlike facebook, they also weren't just caught running a dark money lobbyist network with the goal of forcing more collection of minors' private information.

Re: FBI is buying location data to track US citizens, director confirms

#130

Post by tamimio »

I don’t thinks there’s any person who doesn’t know this information already, yet you keep seeing the same empty articles of “oh yes they collect your data using commercial apps”.. list all these apps to consumers, list the services too, list the companies that are selling them, so people will stop using them or at least limit its access. I know most social media are, but there are far more companies and apps that are willing to sell such data.
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