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Honda is killing its EVs

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Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#341

Post by sanex »

neogodless wrote: post #144
bryanlarsen wrote: post #123

OTOH, it really looks like Toyota is Goldilocks. Most companies invested too much too early and had to write off a substantial amount, but Toyota is rolling into 2027 with a small but nice selection of EV's. Over 25% of vehicles sold world-wide were electric in 2025, and that percentage is steadily increasing. So VW & Ford were "too hot", Honda is looking like "too cold" and Toyota might be the "just right" of the th…

Where does that leave GM?

Quietly making some of the highest rated EVs right now.

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#343

Post by laughing_man »

yndoendo wrote: post #191
bwestergard wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"exporting your own oil and gas to be able to have a 'clean' (and up to recently heavily subsidized) transportation network is in a way just a gigantic bookkeeping trick" How so? If every oil exporter used some of their oil revenue to switch to EVs, that would, all things equal, hasten the transition to EVs. The U.S. is not doing that.

I still find it funny when it comes to oil between the USA and Saudi Arabia. Saudi Arabia started moving the electrical system to renewables where USA is doubling down on fossil fuels. Saudi Arabia is the drug dealer that knows you don't consumer your own supply unless you must were the USA consumes the crack they sell. My next vehicle will 100% be pure EV, not Tesla.

Transitioning to renewables makes economic sense for the Saudis because they make more money selling a barrel of oil for transportation fuel and generating power with wind and solar.

The US has vast reserves of coal and natural gas. We generally don't use oil to generate power either -- oil is something like 0.4% of the total power generated, because we have vast amounts of natural gas and coal to use instead.

The situation isn't the result of some crafty master plan on the part of the Saudis. It's jusut what makes sense.

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#344

Post by nxm »

speedgoose wrote: post #152
jacquesm wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I live in a top EV market, Norway. It is the top EV market. > I figure most other countries will be the same. Most other countries are not Norway, it is a very wealthy, tiny market (150 K vehicles/year) with lots of hydro and not representative of the typical vehicle market in Western Europe and definitely not representative of the situation in the rest of the world. EVs are the future, there is no doubt about that…

At least it doesn’t smell ICE fumes downtown. That’s neat.

Haven’t smell fumes downtown in 30 years since catalytic converters became prevalent

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#345

Post by raw_anon_1111 »

jacquesm wrote: post #92
TrackerFF wrote: post #85

I live in a top EV market, Norway. ICE cars have been planned out for years now, and something like 96% of all new cars in Norway were EV last year. Basically, if you plan on keeping selling ICE cars, you're removing yourself from the market here. There's no future for new personal ICE cars here. I figure most other countries will be the same.

> I live in a top EV market, Norway. It is the top EV market. > I figure most other countries will be the same. Most other countries are not Norway, it is a very wealthy, tiny market (150 K vehicles/year) with lots of hydro and not representative of the typical vehicle market in Western Europe and definitely not representative of the situation in the rest of the world. EVs are the future, there is no doubt about that…

They seem to be solving the “Resource Curse” quite well.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resource_curse

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#346

Post by slg »

rkagerer wrote: post #308

Honda is setting itself up for failure on the second disruption sweeping the automotive industry: the software-defined vehicle (SDV), which has core capabilities that can be upgraded and improved over time. No thank you. Not sure why the author frames this as a good thing. They've been bamboozled by the automakers and have got it backwards - you're buying a vehicle that already has the capabilities, but are disabled,…

>you're buying a vehicle that already has the capabilities, but are disabled, then paying rent (or a fee) to turn them on.

This is very much not what "software-defined vehicle" means which itself is very much not the same thing as EVs. It's possible to criticize the explotative business practices you mentioned (or bad UI practices like moving everything to a touchscreen instead of physical buttons) without linking them to other issues that have no real relation beyond falling under the general category of "technology".

At a societal level, EVs are generally better than ICE cars. At a societal level, cars that can automatically fix a "recall" with an over-the-air update are generally better than recalls that will wait to get fixed until an owner schedules an appointment to have the car serviced. These two things can be true without endorsing automakers who charge and extra fee to activate the seat warmers that already exist in the vehicle.

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#347

Post by stackghost »

cyanydeez wrote: post #325
rkagerer wrote: post #308

Honda is setting itself up for failure on the second disruption sweeping the automotive industry: the software-defined vehicle (SDV), which has core capabilities that can be upgraded and improved over time. No thank you. Not sure why the author frames this as a good thing. They've been bamboozled by the automakers and have got it backwards - you're buying a vehicle that already has the capabilities, but are disabled,…

It's techcrunch. The angle of software-everything has to be there. Why honda is killing EVs is directly related to just how damn cheap Chinese EVs have become and how stupid Americans are when it comes to EV efficiency. Who the hell wants large vehicles for EV when the best solutions are small efficient vehicles with long drive times. Americans distort the market and margins, and Honda was never in the large SUV game…

Americans in most of their country are besieged by massive SUVs and pickups.

Driving a tiny little Japanese/Chinese import in, say, Oklahoma is asking to get literally run over.

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#348

Post by patmorgan23 »

blargey wrote: post #291
jasonfarnon wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If every oil exporter used some of their oil revenue to switch to EVs, that would, all things equal, hasten the transition to EVs." The premise is all things aren't equal. The oil Norway would have used just gets used somewhere else so what difference does it make what Norway does instead. I don't know if that's the reality of the situation but if it is just an offset, it does sound like a bookkeeping trick doesn't…

Norway switching from ICEs to EVs objectively reduces global oil consumption+burning by exactly that much. Norway exporting oil increases oil supply, but doesn't increase consumption. The world's oil consumers are not supply-constrained; the producers are not running at 100% capacity, and they'll happily pick up the slack if Norway just stopped exporting oil for no reason. And there's a large amount of consumption th…

Increases in supply also increase consumption, we use lots of cheap stuff, but not very much of expensive stuff.

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#349

Post by ggm-at-algebras »

In Shenzhen for a tech meeting. The streetscape is quieter, despite high traffic levels and I hear not only MORE birdsong, but the birds do more complex songlines.

The air is clean. For sure some of this is because it's a coastal city and has fresh sea breezes, but I've been in other Chinese coastal cities in times past and the air was significantly less clean.

There are social upsides for an almost-all-EV city.

This is an 18m person city. It's not exclusively wealthy people, its just a city with a very high local EV population and it shows.

Re: Honda is killing its EVs

#350

Post by raw_anon_1111 »

rob74 wrote: post #266
appreciatorBus wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the drug dealer that knows you don't consumer your own supply unless you must So true. There's nothing incompatible at all with: a) realizing that earth has gifted you with a valuable but limited & polluting energy source b) realizing that you'd be foolish to get you own country hooked on it, but it's not a bad business if you can get other countries hooked on it. Instead we get oil rich areas seemingly determined…

Wow, so now the US oil barons who lobbied Trump to kill renewables and EVs are even worse than Mohammed "Bonesaw*" bin Salman Al Saud? That's really something, if you look at it that way... * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination_of_Jamal_Khashog...

How many people have Trump’s wars in Venezuela and Iran killed?
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