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Claws are now a new layer on top of LLM agents

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Re: Claws are now a new layer on top of LLM agents

#181

Post by embedding-shape »

arcwhite wrote: post #151
embedding-shape wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a very different approach, and a bot user is very different from a regular Telegram account, it won't be nearly as "useful", at least in the way I thought openclaw was supposed to work. For example, a bot account cannot initiate conversations, so everyone would need to first message the bot, doesn't that defeat the entire purpose of giving openclaw access to it then? I thought they were supposed to be your ass…

Once a conversation with a user is established, telegram bots can bleep away at you. Mine pings me whenever it puts a PR up, and when it's done responding to code reviews etc.

Right, but again that's not actually outbound at all, what you're describing is only inbound. Again, I thought the whole point was that the agent could start acting autonomously to some degree, not allow outbound kind of defeats the entire purpose, doesn't it?

Re: Claws are now a new layer on top of LLM agents

#182

Post by selcuka »

amelius wrote: post #153
krelian wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you give some example for what you use it for? I understand giving a summary of what's waiting in your inbox but what else?

Extending your driver's license. Asking the bank for a second mortgage. Finding the right high school for your kids. The possibilities are endless. /s <- okay

Is this sarcasm? These all sound like things that I would never use current LLMs for.

Re: Claws are now a new layer on top of LLM agents

#183

Post by Goofy_Coyote »

enderforth wrote: post #154
weinzierl wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think there are two different things at work here that deserve to be separated: 1. The compliance box tickers and bean counters are in the way of innovation and it hurts companies. 2. Claws derive their usefulness mainly from having broad permissions, not only to you local system but also to your accounts via your real identity [1]. Carefulness is very much warranted. [1] People correct me if I'm misguided, but tha…

It's been my experience that there are 2 types of security people. 1. Are the security people who got into a security because it was one of the only places that let them work with every part of the stack, and exposure to dozens of different domains on the regular, and the idea of spending hours understanding and then figuring out ways around whitelist validations are appealing 2. Those that don't have much technical…

> ask their opinion on the CISSP

This made me lol.

It's a good test, however, I wouldn't ask it in a public setting lol, you have to ask them in a more private chat - at least for me, I'm not gonna talk bad about a massive org (ISC2) knowing that tons of managers and execs swear by them, but if you ask for my personal opinion in a more relaxed setting (and I do trust you to some extent), then you'll get a more nuanced and different answer.

Same test works for CEH. If they felt insulted and angry, they get an A+ (joking...?).

Re: Claws are now a new layer on top of LLM agents

#184

Post by chrisjj »

throwaway_z0om wrote: post #93
ggrab wrote: post #53

IMO the security pitchforking on OpenClaw is just so overdone. People without consideration for the implications will inevitably get burned, as we saw with the reddit posts "Agentic Coding tool X wiped my hard drive and apologized profusely". I work at a FAANG and every time you try something innovative the "policy people" will climb out of their holes and put random roadblocks in your way, not for the sake of actual…

> the "policy people" will climb out of their holes I am one of those people and I work at a FANG. And while I know it seems annoying, these teams are overwhelmed with not only innovators but lawyers asking so many variations of the same question it's pretty hard to get back to the innovators with a thumbs up or guidance. Also there is a real threat here. The "wiped my hard drive" story is annoying but it's a toy pro…

> I'm actively trying to find a way we can unblock innovators to move quickly at scale

So did "Move fast and break things" not work out? /i

Re: Claws are now a new layer on top of LLM agents

#185

Post by chrisjj »

mikkupikku wrote: post #119
throwaway_z0om wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the "policy people" will climb out of their holes I am one of those people and I work at a FANG. And while I know it seems annoying, these teams are overwhelmed with not only innovators but lawyers asking so many variations of the same question it's pretty hard to get back to the innovators with a thumbs up or guidance. Also there is a real threat here. The "wiped my hard drive" story is annoying but it's a toy pro…

I am sure there are many good corporate security policy people doing important work. But then there are people like this; I get handed an application developed by my company for use by partner companies. It's a java application, shipped as a jar, nothing special. It gets signed by our company, but anybody with the wherewithal can pull the jar apart and mod the application however they wish. One of the partner compani…

> he's just going to mod the signature check out, because he doesn't want to have to deal with this shit

Fine. The compliance catastrophe will be his company's not yours'.

Re: Claws are now a new layer on top of LLM agents

#187

Post by mycall »

fxj wrote: post #69

He also talks about picoclaw which even runs on $10 hardware and is a fork by sipeed, a chinese company who does IoT. https://github.com/sipeed/picoclaw another chinese coompany m5stack provides local LLMs like Qwen2.5-1.5B running on a local IoT device. https://shop.m5stack.com/products/m5stack-llm-large-language... Imagine the possibilities. Soon we will see claw-in-a-box for less than $50.

> Imagine the possibilities

1.5B models are not very bright which doesn't give me much hope for what they could "claw" or accomplish.

Re: Claws are now a new layer on top of LLM agents

#188

Post by igravious »

snovv_crash wrote: post #48
mattlondon wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think for me it is an agent that runs on some schedule, checks some sort of inbox (or not) and does things based on that. Optionally it has all of your credentials for email, PayPal, whatever so that it can do things on your behalf. Basically cron-for-agents. Before we had to go prompt an agent to do something right now but this allows them to be async, with more of a YOLO-outlook on permissions to use your creds,…

Cron would be for a polling model. You can also have an interrupts/events model that triggers it on incoming information (eg. new email, WhatsApp, incoming bank payments etc). I still don't see a way this wouldn't end up with my bank balance being sent to somewhere I didn't want.

> I still don't see a way

1) don't give it access to your bank

2) if you do give it access don't give it direct access (have direct access blocked off and indirect access 2FA to something physical you control and the bot does not have access to)

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agreed or not?

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think of it like this -- if you gave a human power to drain you bank balance but put in no provision to stop them doing just that would that personal advisor of yours be to blame or you?

Re: Claws are now a new layer on top of LLM agents

#189

Post by logicprog »

krtagf wrote: post #165

[flagged]

This doesn't seem to be promoting every new monstrosity?

"m definitely a bit sus'd to run OpenClaw specifically - giving my private data/keys to 400K lines of vibe coded monster that is being actively attacked at scale is not very appealing at all. Already seeing reports of exposed instances, RCE vulnerabilities, supply chain poisoning, malicious or compromised skills in the registry, it feels like a complete wild west and a security nightmare. But I do love the concept and I think that just like LLM agents were a new layer on top of LLMs, Claws are now a new layer on top of LLM agents, taking the orchestration, scheduling, context, tool calls and a kind of persistence to a next level.

Looking around, and given that the high level idea is clear, there are a lot of smaller Claws starting to pop out."

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