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The UK is shaping a future of precrime and dissent management (2025)

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Re: The UK is shaping a future of precrime and dissent management (2025)

#61

Post by simmerup »

FpUser wrote: post #18

I wonder at what point these countries will loose any moral ground against the likes of Russia, China etc. Up until this point it was mostly that they would gladly fuck the other countries up but treated their own people way better than the other camp. But this difference is disappearing. Of course there is always North Korea and other totally fucked up regimes they could use to compare and look white and fluffy

Iran used machine guns in protesters

China used tanks against students

Russia still has gulags for people who criticise the government

You’re incredibly naive if you think they’re the same as us

Re: The UK is shaping a future of precrime and dissent management (2025)

#62

Post by throwaway85825 »

FpUser wrote: post #18

I wonder at what point these countries will loose any moral ground against the likes of Russia, China etc. Up until this point it was mostly that they would gladly fuck the other countries up but treated their own people way better than the other camp. But this difference is disappearing. Of course there is always North Korea and other totally fucked up regimes they could use to compare and look white and fluffy

'Moral ground' was the product of a controlled media environment.

Re: The UK is shaping a future of precrime and dissent management (2025)

#63

Post by dijksterhuis »

mc32 wrote: post #19
spacebanana7 wrote: post #8

This is how you govern from a position of unpopularity. The government knows they’re on the wrong side of many issues, to the point they know they can’t win an open debate. So media control, regulation by enforcement, and institutional control becomes the focus of effort.

[flagged]

> It’s very sad to see what’s happening over there

looks out window.

i don’t see a ministry of truth or posters of Big Brother. i think we’re still a ways away from 1984.

Re: The UK is shaping a future of precrime and dissent management (2025)

#64

Post by pjc50 »

mc32 wrote: post #50
simmerup wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting how you think being shot by authorities is less bad than being talked to for shitposting on X

[flagged]

> Are you outraged by all police shootings?

Only the unjustified ones, which is quite a lot of them in the US. They should automatically result in at least a public inquiry.

> On average three people are killed by LE per day.

In the US. This is a stupidly high number.

On average three people per year are killed by police in England&Wales. https://www.inquest.org.uk/fatal-police-shootings

Re: The UK is shaping a future of precrime and dissent management (2025)

#65

Post by pjc50 »

miroljub wrote: post #39
spacebanana7 wrote: post #8

This is how you govern from a position of unpopularity. The government knows they’re on the wrong side of many issues, to the point they know they can’t win an open debate. So media control, regulation by enforcement, and institutional control becomes the focus of effort.

> So media control, regulation by enforcement, and institutional control becomes the focus of effort. You forgot gun control. That's the first thing they took away. Thereafter, freedom after freedom has been made optional by the government [1]. When government becomes overreaching, and you don't have the means to protect yourself and your rights, that's where it goes. [1] I said "government", but probably "regime" wo…

The guns in the US don't seem to be helping people avoid getting shot by ICE.

(to the extent that armed revolution worked in the UK, the IRA were helped only slightly by US-backed supplies of Armalite rifles, and much more by a large supply of Libyan high explosives. Guns are a much less effective political weapon than the car or truck or hotel bomb)

Re: The UK is shaping a future of precrime and dissent management (2025)

#66

Post by throwaway85825 »

simmerup wrote: post #49
mapt wrote: post #26

This is a thousand times as concerning in the context of London than in the context of Baltimore. It addresses a concern that doesn't exist for the UK public, in a way that appears intended to oppress from the start, against a backdrop of arresting thousands of pensioners for disagreeing about a genocide.

The only people being arrested in the Uk are for supporting a proscribed group. A group that broke a police officers back with sledge hammers, committed multiple acts of vandalism against our military, and have tons of links to Hamas They can oppose Israel action in Palestine, they just can’t support terrorists

De facto, arresting 80 year old women for holding signs is always going to look authoritarian. They're not exactly the type to strap on a vest but we have to pretend we dont know what a terrorist looks like.

Re: The UK is shaping a future of precrime and dissent management (2025)

#67

Post by whynotmaybe »

miroljub wrote: post #39
spacebanana7 wrote: post #8

This is how you govern from a position of unpopularity. The government knows they’re on the wrong side of many issues, to the point they know they can’t win an open debate. So media control, regulation by enforcement, and institutional control becomes the focus of effort.

> So media control, regulation by enforcement, and institutional control becomes the focus of effort. You forgot gun control. That's the first thing they took away. Thereafter, freedom after freedom has been made optional by the government [1]. When government becomes overreaching, and you don't have the means to protect yourself and your rights, that's where it goes. [1] I said "government", but probably "regime" wo…

I still don't know what's so important about guns and how it's a metric for freedom.

Re: The UK is shaping a future of precrime and dissent management (2025)

#68

Post by slfreference »

fabianholzer wrote: post #25
FpUser wrote: post #18

I wonder at what point these countries will loose any moral ground against the likes of Russia, China etc. Up until this point it was mostly that they would gladly fuck the other countries up but treated their own people way better than the other camp. But this difference is disappearing. Of course there is always North Korea and other totally fucked up regimes they could use to compare and look white and fluffy

> I wonder at what point these countries will loose any moral ground against the likes of Russia, China etc. When arbitrary extrajudicial killings happen at some scale on a regular basis?

I heard Boeing whistleblowers died unexpectedly.

Two prominent Boeing whistleblowers, John Barnett (died March 2024) and Joshua Dean (died April 2024), have died in recent times, raising significant concerns about retaliation and safety at the aerospace giant; Barnett died from a self-inflicted gunshot wound after battling Boeing in a retaliation lawsuit, while Dean died from a sudden infection after raising quality concerns, with his family suspecting foul play despite official rulings. Barnett's death was ruled a suicide, though his family's wrongful death suit claims Boeing's harassment caused his distress, while Dean's death followed rapid illness, with his family also alleging misconduct by his employer, Spirit Aerosystems, and Boeing.

Re: The UK is shaping a future of precrime and dissent management (2025)

#69

Post by liveoneggs »

budududuroiu wrote: post #41

In China, the social contract at least is "you give up some individual freedoms and some privacy, never dissent against the government, and in exchange the government promises you prosperity" I wonder what the Brits get in exchange for their giving up of personal freedoms?

The people who talk pretty get to keep buying nice houses for their kids. It seems like a pretty good deal.

Re: The UK is shaping a future of precrime and dissent management (2025)

#70

Post by myrmidon »

budududuroiu wrote: post #41

In China, the social contract at least is "you give up some individual freedoms and some privacy, never dissent against the government, and in exchange the government promises you prosperity" I wonder what the Brits get in exchange for their giving up of personal freedoms?

Brits already have more prosperity (=> median wages) even after adjusting for purchasing power.

Some stagnation is to be expected from high energy prices and trade disruption (brexit).

British surveillance state tolerance has always been pretty high for Europe, and is typically "sold" to the average citizen as anti-crime.

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