Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

In New York City, congestion pricing leads to marked drop in pollution

e360.yale.edu

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

121–130 of 524 posts

Re: In New York City, congestion pricing leads to marked drop in pollution

#121

Post by ceejayoz »

MLgulabio wrote: post #113
ceejayoz wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

NYC has 8M people and 2M cars. Manhattan has like a 22% car ownership rate, and it's… not the poor people. https://www.hunterurban.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/06/Car-L... A parking spot will cost you more than rent in some other cities.

This doesn't change my argument at all. The more money you have, more you benefit from this ruling. Now you can buy a service which was not possible before.

> Now you can buy a service which was not possible before.

It wasn't possible to drive a car in NYC before congestion pricing? I find that… unlikely.

Re: In New York City, congestion pricing leads to marked drop in pollution

#122

Post by whimsicalism »

I would really appreciate it if the Bay area got real congestion pricing and also enforcement. We have lots of HOT lanes here, but they are basically unenforced so everyone sets their ez-pass to “3” and gets the free HOV pricing, which rapidly becomes economical at the rate of enforcement in the Bay.

Frankly, if they let me citizen report - I could likely cover my entire tax burden in 2-3 days. At $490/ticket, the ROI for enforcement seems obviously there.

Re: In New York City, congestion pricing leads to marked drop in pollution

#123

Post by PunchyHamster »

throwawaypath wrote: post #5
lkbm wrote: post #2

> Particulates issued from tailpipes can aggravate asthma and heart disease and increase the risk of lung cancer and heart attack. Globally, they are a leading risk factor for premature death. Minor nitpick, but tailpipes aren't the primary source of emissions. The study is about PM2.5[0]. which will chiefly be tires and brake pads. Modern gasoline engines are relatively clean, outside of CO2, though diesel engines s…

How do EVs fare in this regard? Brakes are used significantly less, but the additional weight from the batteries chews through tires faster.

I'd gonna guess "worse"

Brake dust is mostly some iron, carbon, silica. Not great to ingest but very much recyclable by the environment, unlike rubber.

And possibly much easier to greatly reduce (just build some shielding around the brake to catch most of the dust) than the tyre

Re: In New York City, congestion pricing leads to marked drop in pollution

#125

Post by Aurornis »

lkbm wrote: post #2

> Particulates issued from tailpipes can aggravate asthma and heart disease and increase the risk of lung cancer and heart attack. Globally, they are a leading risk factor for premature death. Minor nitpick, but tailpipes aren't the primary source of emissions. The study is about PM2.5[0]. which will chiefly be tires and brake pads. Modern gasoline engines are relatively clean, outside of CO2, though diesel engines s…

> though diesel engines spit out a bunch of bad stuff.

Exactly. The noxious tailpipe emissions in a city are usually from diesel trucks, small vehicles like motorcycles (small or absent catalytic converters), modified vehicles (catalytic converter removed or diesel reprogrammed to smoke), but not modern gasoline ICE vehicles.

The love for diesel engines in many European countries was always confusing to me.

PM2.5 is also a broad category of particulates that come from many sources. The PM2.5 levels in the air depend on many sources, with wind being a major factor in changing PM2.5 levels. It’s hard to draw conclusions when a number depends on the weather and a lot of other inputs.

Re: In New York City, congestion pricing leads to marked drop in pollution

#126

Post by sandworm101 »

ceejayoz wrote: post #83
nabla9 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tires and brakes. With EV's this gets relatively worse because they are heavier.

But the tires are individually controlled - less slippage - and the brakes are regenerative. As a bonus, NYC is pretty much best-case scenario for the latter.

With extea weight and tire size, evs will have more slippage. It isnt about the entire tire slipping against the ground. It is about tread patterns slipping as the tire rolls at any speed, especially in corners where car tires cannot ever avoid slipping.

Re: In New York City, congestion pricing leads to marked drop in pollution

#129

Post by acdha »

MLgulabio wrote: post #81

[flagged]

Because that’s not true. Cars are expensive compared to transit everywhere, but especially so in NYC. This was studied a lot before congestion pricing was implemented and only something like 2% of poor people were going to pay congestion charges. This did not stop a bunch of rich suburbanites from using them as a prop to demand that the city subsidize their lifestyle at the expense of NYC taxpayers, of course.

https://www.cssny.org/news/entry/the-cost-of-killing-congest...

Re: In New York City, congestion pricing leads to marked drop in pollution

#130

Post by jpfromlondon »

onemoresoop wrote: post #78

It may have dropped pollution in Manhattan but I guess more pollution added up to the surrounding borroughs in addition to more traffic.

Good question, this happened in London for sure, congestion charging increased the net pollution from vehicles but reduced the metrics inside the city, probably not much either way.
Post reply on HN