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Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

bbc.com

161–170 of 465 posts

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#161

The article is using "voluntary" in a very questionable fashion. > Germany's parliament, the Bundestag, has voted to introduce voluntary military service... > The form will be mandatory for men and voluntary for women. > The government says military service will be voluntary for as long as possible, but from July 2027, all 18-year-old men will have to take a medical exam to assess their fitness for possible military…

> There's nothing here that could be really described as "voluntary".

that's the same "voluntary" they use for Chat Control, by the way.

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#162
post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you'd rather read Russian propaganda? Weird choice.

> So you'd rather read Russian propaganda? Propaganda happens on both sides during a war. You just need to be aware of it.

These arguments always try to imply that both sides are equally bad, which is not the case (by far).

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#163

[flagged]

Can Germans elaborate on this? I have heard some stories but I don’t know the truth of them.

Yes, the billboard advertisement part is true. But billboards in Germany are fewer and smaller than in other parts of the world. And the Bundeswehr ad campaign is nothing that will convince anyone who would not be convinced otherwise already. If you notice the ads as a German citizen at all, you'll most likely shrug, or ask your self: Since. When. Is. It. Ok. To. Pretend. A. Single. Word. Forms. A. Sentence? (for context: the ad says "Wir. Dienen. Deutschland." which translates verbatim as "We. Serve. Germany." - which, if my English as a second language grammar knowledge does not fail me, would also make no grammatical sense in English.

As for the rest, of course you see quite a few people that do not look like the von Trapp family singers, or whatever shaped your stereotype of how ethnic Germans are supposed to look like. Apropos ethnic Germans, historically we happen to be a two digit number of distinct tribes anyhow, and it still is suprisingly easy to piss one of the natives off by confusing them for a member of the wrong tribe. But I am digressing.

What I can say, all ethnicity questions cast aside, the governments in the time that I am following the news (the very late Kohl era), which have been nine different now, are all quite the same in one way: kicking the can down the road and pulling up the ladder from above. The state/society/economy I grew up in had quite some substance of which it could coast off for some time.

But as with all things that go down south: Gradually, then suddenly.

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#164
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What I didn't see were any young Germans Seems ~20% of the population are immigrants ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuremberg#Demographics ), some of the people you saw are Germans and some of them are not, but I think the main confusing part is how you mix up how someone looks and what nationality they have. I think maybe you're trying to say "white" instead, but for some reason avoided using that word?

> I think maybe you're trying to say "white" instead Not sure what you are babbling about but, It's about ethnicity and not race. Plenty of third generation Turks still don't consider themselves German, then someone with black skin adopted as a child might consider themself German, it's about culture not race, we're not in last century anymore. Proportion of young people with immigrant background is high in many West…

It's plain to see that it's the racists who aren't integrated and properly socialized, not the people "with a background".

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It sounds like you believe life in western democracy is exactly the same as life in modern imperial Russia, like if you could choose, you would have no preference whatsoever?

[flagged]

> The UK locks up more people for speech crimes than Russia does.

Do you think there might be a fairly obvious reason for that?

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#167
post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Classic move: make the kids struggle, then offer them a lifeline if they just put on a uniform. The GI bill is great, but you shouldn't have to step on an IED to go to college.

Nah... That's a cute idea but here's some actual data: https://www.bundeswehrkarriere.de/downloads/mannschaften/936 tl;dr: Okay but it's not golden by any means.

FWIW for a lot of East German youths born into poor families that's pretty good money at 18 years age.

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#169
post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is wrong. I used to work in cafes when I still lived in the city and two locations where close to hospitals and everyone I talked to complained about the risk of employing people with huge language barriers (mostly Ukrainians and Syrians from what I heard) in health related jobs because it has dire consequences if something gets lost in translation. No one of the higher ups cared and they just had to deal with w…

There just isn't enough people who are local and want to do this job for this pay. This happens in Germany but also in my home country. In Germany there is a whole industry around recruiting foreign nurses. I work in immigration and a few of my colleagues specialise in that. There are websites and initiatives just for that. It will get worse. This population is aging.

That's only half true. You have lots of trained and experienced people willing to do this job despite the low pay because some of these people wouldn't function in a field where they couldn't help other people, even if they sacrifice their own health and financial situation for it.

The issue lies with state subsidies for employing refugees which currently mainly targets Ukrainian workers, though they'll never outright say it: https://www.arbeitsagentur.de/unternehmen/arbeitskraefte/gef...

If you have a job to offer you can now decide if you pay a German out of your own pocket or if you hire a Ukrainian who will end up being cheaper for you because the state supports you in doing so.

Have seen this with bicycle mechanics, nurses, nursery homes, lots and lots of cafés.

Goes without saying that I like Ukrainian people just as much as I like Germans, Syrians, Iranians, Russians, etc.

Re: Germany votes to bring in voluntary military service programme for 18-year-olds

#170
post #28

To offer a bit of context, the same government just voted to raise current pensions at the expense of steep taxation hikes for current workers, made massive cuts to social services, and is now discussing military service. This generation is rightfully feeling like they're getting a sore deal.

Classic move: make the kids struggle, then offer them a lifeline if they just put on a uniform. The GI bill is great, but you shouldn't have to step on an IED to go to college.

FYI, higher education is practically free in Germany.
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