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The disguised return of EU Chat Control

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61–70 of 354 posts

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#61
Society can't win this without fighting the personalities who drive it. In the end, there's a individual that pushes this, so this very person should be targeted personally.

Someone said it's an asymmetric conflict, so we need to pull it to our (human-size) level and fight on our chessboard.

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#62
post #35

This is an asymmetric conflict. The factions who want this to pass have more resources, time and background influence and can keep pushing this until they get lucky. And once in place repealing it will be tremendously difficult. How does society resolve this kind of abuse of the democratic process? It is a dynamic that is repeated in many areas.

> How does society resolve this kind of abuse of the democratic process? It is a dynamic that is repeated in many areas. A lot of society wants this. A lot of parents are asking for this.

That doesn't mean anything, because they're not necessarily educated on the topic, and yet are making decisions that affect everyone.

When it's so cheap to enact mass propaganda, selective omission and manufactured intent, it becomes impossible to just say, "well, the people want it." Their decision making process is compromised by the same people pushing these policies through.

Democracy is indeed broken, and we have to take that seriously if we're going to fix it.

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#63

(6) Online child sexual abuse frequently involves the misuse of information society services offered in the Union by providers established in third countries. In order to ensure the effectiveness of the rules laid down in this Regulation and a level playing field within the internal market, those rules should apply to all providers, irrespective of their place of establishment or residence, that offer services in the…

So they’re asking American companies to repeal the first amendment rights of American citizens on all websites accessible in the EU. How this not a declaration of war?

"First Amendment Rights" only applies to the State, not private companies.

For example, Hacker News has no obligation to preserve your "First Amendment Rights" on this website. They are free to mute you, ban you, or even just surreptitiously change what you say without you knowing.

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#64

(6) Online child sexual abuse frequently involves the misuse of information society services offered in the Union by providers established in third countries. In order to ensure the effectiveness of the rules laid down in this Regulation and a level playing field within the internal market, those rules should apply to all providers, irrespective of their place of establishment or residence, that offer services in the…

> worldwide

Laws targeting service providers usually always apply to all providers providing services in the respective jurisdiction. It would be unusual if it was any different.

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We stop allowing the rich to become so rich. Billionares are not compatible with democracy or the greater good.

What happens when you get what you want, and rather than magically solving every problem confronting society, it doesn't solve anything at all, and in fact creates several more problems, as generally happens when such ideas are put into practice? What's plan B? Lower the threshold to a million dollars?

Also how do you avoid billionaires worldwide? Not everyone lives under your government. Even if you could, how do you know for a fact that some people don't secretly control hidden assets? Is Xi openly a billionaire? China is a "communist" country on paper. How does he hold so much power?

The sad reality is that the world has a nonzero percentage of power-hungry narcissists. We need governments that are more democratic and robust. We all know that the current government processes are broken and corrupted.

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#66
post #35

This is an asymmetric conflict. The factions who want this to pass have more resources, time and background influence and can keep pushing this until they get lucky. And once in place repealing it will be tremendously difficult. How does society resolve this kind of abuse of the democratic process? It is a dynamic that is repeated in many areas.

> How does society resolve this kind of abuse of the democratic process? Other than hoping for a large meteorite or the second coming to end this misery, or stirring up the bloodbath a la Nepal - then, by recognizing the power of large numbers of people doing little things, like sabotaging the system at the personal level. But that implies unity, and unity and mutual support have been deliberately annihilated in this…

I'm downvoting you because complaining against downvotes like this is against site guidelines. Your comment would have a better foundation if that part was omitted.

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#67
post #35

This is an asymmetric conflict. The factions who want this to pass have more resources, time and background influence and can keep pushing this until they get lucky. And once in place repealing it will be tremendously difficult. How does society resolve this kind of abuse of the democratic process? It is a dynamic that is repeated in many areas.

This is true and yet we managed to kick SOPA to the curb (one of Aaron Swartz's finest hours)

That was more than a decade ago. Think how many normies have come online since then that have only ever used a smartphone. Sadly the average computer literacy of those times are gone.

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#68
post #53

The right to privacy is enshrined in the European Convention on Human Rights, article 8 [0]. It escapes me how politicians can repeatedly attempt to violate this. [0] https://fra.europa.eu/en/law-reference/european-convention-h...

Think of the children.

You want the police to solve crimes, right?

If you are against this it is because you have something to hide.

Also it is more than possible that those politicians do not agree with that Convention.

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#69
post #35

This is an asymmetric conflict. The factions who want this to pass have more resources, time and background influence and can keep pushing this until they get lucky. And once in place repealing it will be tremendously difficult. How does society resolve this kind of abuse of the democratic process? It is a dynamic that is repeated in many areas.

>How does society resolve this kind of abuse of the democratic process?

Swiss style democracy with public referendums?

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#70
post #35

This is an asymmetric conflict. The factions who want this to pass have more resources, time and background influence and can keep pushing this until they get lucky. And once in place repealing it will be tremendously difficult. How does society resolve this kind of abuse of the democratic process? It is a dynamic that is repeated in many areas.

> How does society resolve this kind of abuse of the democratic process? It is a dynamic that is repeated in many areas. A lot of society wants this. A lot of parents are asking for this.

Please quantify "a lot". What percentage of the population wants all private communication between adults to be monitored and censored by a government agency? Can we put it to a vote - right after publicly discussing (debunking) all of the false beliefs that its proponents have?
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