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How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized
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Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized
#892Israel's response to Oct 7th has been a major blackpill. Their strategy was, I think, as bad as it could possibly be. In fact, it really seemed, and still seems, like no strategy at all -- they lashed out wildly and extremely destructively, without a clear picture of what the post-war Gaza Strip will look like. Hamas successfully baited Israel into a disproportionate response that killed tens of thousands, if not hun…
Israel has tried responding to attacks by not killing hundreds of thousands of people, and that approach led to October 7th.
It’s been way too short a time to tell if this will work, but responding in a softer manner has proven to not. Might work is better than won’t work.
Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized
#893Earlier quoted context omitted.
Famine is political, always. The world produces a significant excess of food. The only reason famine exists is because one group of people is perfectly happy to starve another group of people. Gaza is not unique here although Gaza is a aprticularly egregious example of industrial mass starvation and death at the hands of a highly-developed military and state actor.
I can't disagree. Modern famine is a tool used to cause harm indiscriminately. It is a testament to the human capacity for cognitive dissonance that so many people can be against the starvation of children yet support politicians responsible for mass starvation. Though my point was more about considering the historical context. Famines used to happen all the time but largely because of crop failures. That famine is _…
You make a good point, and it extends to other disasters besides famine. As humans we have evolved to the point where there are certain problems that we can eliminate -- starvation being one of them as you pointed out -- thanks to technological solutions. And yet, we deliberately choose not to. There are millions of people who die each year whose deaths are wholly preventable -- we have the technology and the resources to prevent them (without harming anyone else) -- but we choose not to, mostly so that some relatively small group of people can amass more wealth than they need. Humans have always been that way, I suppose, but never have these solutions been more within our grasp and yet, we choose not to use them. It's a terrible indictment against the human race.
Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized
#894“Israel has built the most efficient starvation machine you can imagine.” There's political opposition to this within Israel. Here's what happened to an elected member of the Knesset who spoke out against the cruelty in Gaza.[1] He was forcibly removed from the podium of the Knesset. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzDxV7jnAos
People sometimes forget how bitterly divided Israel was before October 7th, with hundreds of thousands of people protesting in the streets. The war put some of the infighting on hold for a while, but all the former problems still exist, and the stakes are higher.
Which is probably one of the reasons, why they escalated the conflict out of proportion in the first place.
Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized
#895Earlier quoted context omitted.
Sadly I think you are mistaken to paint it as an irrational Israel lashing out - that's too generous. I think it's quite the opposite - there has been a very clear, cold, calculated strategy - which is to use the conflict as an cover for doing what some in the government have always wanted to do ( and been quite open about it ) - which is to create a greater Israel - drive out all Palestinians from the river to the s…
This, for Israel it was a perfect pretext. Netanyahu financed Hamas through Qatar for years because he knew that Hamas is a destructive force for Palestinians and their struggle for nationhood. It was a cold, cynical decision. He exploited the anger and emotions of the people after October 7th to justify what he is doing now.
It was too perfect. To the point where the stand down order stories are believable.
Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized
#896Earlier quoted context omitted.
More details here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_support_for_Hamas
I don't think anyone doubts Israel supported Hamas. But Israel wasn't paying Hamas so they'd launch October 7th.
> Israel wasn't paying Hamas so they'd launch October 7th
Agreed. But as a close friend -- who spent years living and working in the Middle East, including Gaza, and very well connected there -- pointed out to me, it's very hard to believe that Israel, with one of the most, if not the most, heavily guarded borders in the world, with arguably the best intelligence force in the world that is very embedded in the Palestinian Territories, did not know of the attack in advance, if not the details. Think about how much Israel had to gain from letting it happen and it becomes an easy decision.
Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized
#897“Israel has built the most efficient starvation machine you can imagine.” There's political opposition to this within Israel. Here's what happened to an elected member of the Knesset who spoke out against the cruelty in Gaza.[1] He was forcibly removed from the podium of the Knesset. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzDxV7jnAos
The man speaking is Ayman Odeh [1], an Arab Israeli MK and chairman of Hadash, a left-wing Arab Israeli party. Arab Israelis and their political leaders are marginalized in Israeli society. Arab Israeli parties are largely considered illegitimate by a majority of Jewish Israelis. Political opposition to the starvation of Gaza is still marginal, especially in Jewish society. Protests in Arab cities against the starvat…
Israel is where we in the west get shown a mirror in front of our faces. A country led by religious fanatics, who don't respect other religions and for the most part feel no remorse when people of other faith suffer due to their actions or inaction. A genocidal military, that continues its deeds, seemingly aiming to reach ISIS level of despicability. But we have tons of people here, who don't want to see anything wrong with Israel and how it acts. That really shows us our double standards. Religious fanatics are OK for us, as long as they are not against us. Crimes against humanity are OK, as long as they are inflicted upon a group, that is not seen by the mainstream as "us".
We have really lost the plot when it comes to ethics. Not all of us, but many, and especially in our leaderships and governments.
Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized
#898Earlier quoted context omitted.
Here's a thought experiment to underline that, in case there's any confusion. Q. How many times did any Countries hold islamic-only real-estate expos in Mosques for the former and future homes and territories of Jewish peoples either already dispossessed or planned to be dispossessed due to fundamentalist islamic occupation? _Zero_ Q. How many times did any Countries held jewish-only real-estate expos in Synagogues f…
There was no need to hold real estate expos because the ethnic cleansing was a bit more direct during the Armenian and Assyrian genocide. It was atrocious then and it's atrocious now. There's almost something worse about zionst making it a business now. It's one thing to ethnically cleanse an area out of hatred, it's sick on a whole new level to try and turn a buck in the process.
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Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized
#899Israel's response to Oct 7th has been a major blackpill. Their strategy was, I think, as bad as it could possibly be. In fact, it really seemed, and still seems, like no strategy at all -- they lashed out wildly and extremely destructively, without a clear picture of what the post-war Gaza Strip will look like. Hamas successfully baited Israel into a disproportionate response that killed tens of thousands, if not hun…
They're not losing the information war against Hamas, who they can easily kill if they can identify, they're losing it against those concerned with human rights in the free world. International law (in the absence of diplomatic enforcement) has nothing to do with it, and neither does the complex and detailed history that only serves as a way for people to avoid talking about the present...
Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized
#900Israel's response to Oct 7th has been a major blackpill. Their strategy was, I think, as bad as it could possibly be. In fact, it really seemed, and still seems, like no strategy at all -- they lashed out wildly and extremely destructively, without a clear picture of what the post-war Gaza Strip will look like. Hamas successfully baited Israel into a disproportionate response that killed tens of thousands, if not hun…
Sadly I think you are mistaken to paint it as an irrational Israel lashing out - that's too generous. I think it's quite the opposite - there has been a very clear, cold, calculated strategy - which is to use the conflict as an cover for doing what some in the government have always wanted to do ( and been quite open about it ) - which is to create a greater Israel - drive out all Palestinians from the river to the s…
> which is to create a greater Israel
This is fantasy. Israel (or any country really) ability to expand is limited by its neighbors. Egypt, Jordan and the GCC are more powerful than the 60s and the recent UAE message of pulling of the Abraham accord is a clear signal that they have real weight in Washington. Israel cannot, in the current circumstances, expand.
So I agree with your parent. What Israel currently is doing is non-sense and plays in the hands of Hamas (who is not losing, as civilian lost lives do not count in Hamas counter).