Live data from Hacker News

‘I witnessed war crimes’ in Gaza – former worker at GHF aid site [video]

bbc.com

661–670 of 1001 posts

Re: ‘I witnessed war crimes’ in Gaza – former worker at GHF aid site [video]

#661

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s fine to accept your mom or your neighbor changing their mind, but I think we should be skeptical of politicians changing their mind and consider what hidden, calculated motives they may have for changing it now, when they had plenty of information to reach the same conclusion over a year ago.

Then what does winning actually look like today? Sure. Run against these people and support their political opposition in the next election. But take the win on the short term and get food to Gaza.

My concern is the politicians are suddenly flip flopping because they realize in the short term Israel is close to exterminating the entire population of Gaza. Perhaps they will let a pittance of food aid through to prolong the genocide so Netanyahu can stay in power. I have little confidence in US leadership actually having a change of heart now.

Re: ‘I witnessed war crimes’ in Gaza – former worker at GHF aid site [video]

#663
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well the solution certainly isn’t letting an entire People starve to death? By the way, I don’t see criticism of Israel, but Israel’s current extremist government. I’d even argue that supporting Israel means opposing that administration.

Maybe they are not starving: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQx1Qy5Z5fA

Maybe you place your trust in reliable media all over the world instead of random YouTube videos. Journalists are in Gaza right now, putting their life on the line to show you the ground truth—and you dismiss all that due to a channel called "travelingisrael"?

Re: ‘I witnessed war crimes’ in Gaza – former worker at GHF aid site [video]

#664

I see an increasing number of politicians taking the position: "I supported Israel's government's actions when they first attacked, given the goals of destroying Hamas' leadership and freeing hostages, but now that it has turned into a brutal siege with mass civilian casualties on a horrific scale, I'm strongly against their actions." E.g. Macron, Angus King, and many people I know personally. And I think we need to…

It’s fine to accept your mom or your neighbor changing their mind, but I think we should be skeptical of politicians changing their mind and consider what hidden, calculated motives they may have for changing it now, when they had plenty of information to reach the same conclusion over a year ago.

[deleted]

Re: ‘I witnessed war crimes’ in Gaza – former worker at GHF aid site [video]

#665

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's obviously not all Jewish people, but there are unfortunately many Jewish communities who are very supportive of the ongoing genocide in Gaza. Particularly in the US it's something that has allowed what is happening to continue almost exclusively unopposed. More generally the West has morally failed, so certainly not exclusive to any religion. That the term anti-Semitism is constantly used to deflect or tar those…

> It's obviously not all Jewish people Really? Because the initial GP comment did not parameterize Jewish people which hold certain views. The GP comment just said, "How do Jewish people accept the genocide going on right now?" > That the term anti-Semitism is constantly used to deflect or tar those objecting to Israels mass killing of civilians really is equally offensive I would suggest. Ok? I nor anyone else at th…

On the first point of your reply I was agreeing with you, but also felt the need to expand to draw the distinction that a good many people of the Jewish faith actively defend the ongoing genocide and Israel.

On your second point, my follow up comment on anti-Semitism being weaponised feels wholly appropriate in this context. If you can bring attention to something you feel is directly relevant to the conversation I'm not sure why you would not allow me to do the same.

Re: ‘I witnessed war crimes’ in Gaza – former worker at GHF aid site [video]

#666
post #616

Does anyone still need testimonies like these to be convinced that Israel is systematically exterminating the Palestinians using kinetic force and starvation? We're past that point now. Making Gaza unlivable by carpet-bombing the strip, telegraphing mass murder in unambiguous statements at the highest levels of government, dehumanizing the Palestinians and silencing anyone who dares to speak up? I, for one, am thankf…

> Does anyone still need testimonies like these to be convinced that Israel is systematically exterminating the Palestinians using kinetic force and starvation? Before October 7, activists insisted that Gaza’s border restrictions were driven purely by hatred rather than any legitimate security concerns. That view was completely discredited by the attacks on October 7, so forgive me for being skeptical of similarly ab…

Border restrictions: Blockade.

Given the brutal blockade of Gaza, the continuous encroachment of settlers in the occupied territory, the continued refusal of a two-state solution, what exactly Israel expects to happen?

It is not like the Palestinians have F-35s and Abrahams tanks paid by the US in order to wage a proper war against Israel.

Israel, given its own history (google for Irgun, Stern Gang, Lehi, Hagannah, etc) should be able to predict the end result of its actions.

Re: ‘I witnessed war crimes’ in Gaza – former worker at GHF aid site [video]

#667

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m having trouble distilling the essence of your message in a way that leaves us with any common moral ground. Would you agree that “an eye for an eye” type justice is undesirable? Because it seems like you are advocating for genocide as a response to the oct attack, going well beyond “eye for an eye”!

What moral people want is to give Israel the same leeway the allies had in WW2. Nothing more, nothing less. The expectation back then was you should kill Nazis and Japanese until they surrender without any conditions. Hamas always puts conditions on releasing hostages.

I agree. That doesn't make the bombing of Tokyo and Dresden moral acts. War is atrocious by definition.

What is different this time is that most of the west has forgotten what it actually means to be at war and they pontificate from their armchair.

Combine that with the fact that it is generally easier to have empathy for the side that you perceive to be the victim or on the side of justice, and most people truly cannot comprehend how so many Israelis would support their right wing war policies.

I don't think one has to justify the killing of innocent civilians in order to at least try to put themselves in the shoes of people who have been born in Israel and have lived their lives punctuated by the fear of their family or friend being blown up in a bus bombing.

Most people in the west will just not entertain the thought exercise. They'll just dismiss it as "well they invaded Palestine and stole their land", as if this is a justification for suicide bomb attacks or raining rockets over Israeli cities.

I think our collective inability to accept the situation on the ground and push for a compromise is fueling the violence.

Hamas has a strategy where they can leverage their population acceptance of martyrdom in order to gain more and more victim points in their master PR strategy.

Israel feels more and more isolated internationally and they react by giving everybody a big F U and doubling down on their own extremism.

I often hear "Jews should just go back to Europe" as if that is an actual solution.

I believe that if this was any other conflict that didn't involve Jews (e.g. Turks and Kurds) most people would be cheering for peace or they'd be indifferent.

But this conflict has the right mix of inflaming ingredients. There is white colonial guilt and guilt of racism, there is the association of Jews with global capitalism, and associating Jews as "being white".

To be clear, my take is not that since there are other wars like in Sudan, Israel can do whatever they want. All wars should end and every day they continue is a tragedy.

My point is that if one wants to help bring this conflict to an end, one should not put Israel in an impossible position and demand that they simply cease to exist because they "are not native to the land" or similar arguments that people make nowadays.

It's much more effective to pressure Israel to avoid war atrocities if one understands their point of view, their condition and what it means to be under existential threat.

In order to do that you don't have to deny the same to Palestinians.

For some reason most people seem to only reason by taking one side

Re: ‘I witnessed war crimes’ in Gaza – former worker at GHF aid site [video]

#668
post #422

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many of them not much older than two weeks. This reeks like a massive failure of any content moderation process. dang, what is up with factual, on topic comments being flagged en masse within two minutes of writing?

There is a lot of ideologically motivated flagging of comments from all sides. We're trying to go through and unkill reasonable comments, but it's a slow process. You could help by vouching the ones that are not breaking the guidelines, and also by not posting comments that break the guidelines yourself.

I think this is probably a sign that you shouldn't allow these posts on HN, despite the rationale posted by dang in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44718396

If the flagging is such that one point of view is represented ad nauseam and the other point of view is barely represented due to flagging pile on, then it's not actually contributing to discourse at all -- it's just an echo chamber. That does not fit in with what I find valuable in HN.

Re: ‘I witnessed war crimes’ in Gaza – former worker at GHF aid site [video]

#669

I see an increasing number of politicians taking the position: "I supported Israel's government's actions when they first attacked, given the goals of destroying Hamas' leadership and freeing hostages, but now that it has turned into a brutal siege with mass civilian casualties on a horrific scale, I'm strongly against their actions." E.g. Macron, Angus King, and many people I know personally. And I think we need to…

I draw the line far before supporting genocide they should all be in prison.

Re: ‘I witnessed war crimes’ in Gaza – former worker at GHF aid site [video]

#670

Does anyone still need testimonies like these to be convinced that Israel is systematically exterminating the Palestinians using kinetic force and starvation? We're past that point now. Making Gaza unlivable by carpet-bombing the strip, telegraphing mass murder in unambiguous statements at the highest levels of government, dehumanizing the Palestinians and silencing anyone who dares to speak up? I, for one, am thankf…

> Israel is systematically exterminating the Palestinians This would be the dumbest way to do this. It would take centuries to exterminate them at this rate. The genocide narrative makes no sense to any person with a brain.

Actually, they are going pretty fast. Proportionally, it is going even a bit faster than the Darfur genocide.

Israel would need to use their nukes to be more efficient. But this would severely damage the real estate potential of the strip.

Post reply on HN