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OpenAI dropped the price of o3 by 80%

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Re: OpenAI dropped the price of o3 by 80%

#341
post #226

I'd like to offer a cautionary tale that involves my experience after seeing this post. First, I tried enabling o3 via OpenRouter since I have credits with them already. I was met with the following: "OpenAI requires bringing your own API key to use o3 over the API. Set up here: https://openrouter.ai/settings/integrations " So I decided I would buy some API credits with my OpenAI account. I ponied up $20 and started…

I also am using OpenRouter because OpenAI isn't a great fit for me. I also stopped using OpenAI because they expire your API credits even if you don't use them. Yeah, it's only $10, but I'm not spending another dime with them.

After how long do they expire?

Re: OpenAI dropped the price of o3 by 80%

#342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That was a problem in GPT 4 Turbo as well...

IMO its just that the models are very nondeterministic, and people get very different kinds of responses from it. I met a number of people who tried it when it first came out and it was just useless so they stopped trying it, other people (including me) got gobsmacking great responses and it felt like AGI was around the corner, but after enough coin flips your luck runs out and you get some lazy responses. Some peopl…

GPT4-Turbo had some major "laziness" problems, like really major ones. I posted about this a year back.https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39985596#39987726

I am not saying they haven't improved the laziness problem, but it does happen anecdotally. I even got similar sort of "lazy" responses for something I am building with gemini-2.5-flash.

Re: OpenAI dropped the price of o3 by 80%

#343
post #341

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also am using OpenRouter because OpenAI isn't a great fit for me. I also stopped using OpenAI because they expire your API credits even if you don't use them. Yeah, it's only $10, but I'm not spending another dime with them.

After how long do they expire?

IIRC, 1 year

Re: OpenAI dropped the price of o3 by 80%

#344

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not a PR statement, it's a change in price. Literally putting money where the mouth is.

Or they are trying to gobble up market share because Anthropic has been much better than OpenAI

Providers are exceptionally easy to switch. There's no moat for enterprise-level usage. There's no "market share" to gobble up because I can change a line in my config, run the eval suite, and switch immediately to another provider.

This is marginally less true for embedding models and things you've fine-tuned, but only marginally.

Re: OpenAI dropped the price of o3 by 80%

#345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What should be going on? A regular Google search for "openai persona verify organization" shows withpersona.com in the second search result.

Yeah ok guess I misremembered it a bit but I was curious too and found the previous one I've thought of: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43795406

Good eye! In this case, complaints are numerous. See a web search for:

openai persona verification site:community[.]openai[.]com

e.g. a thread with 36 posts beginning Apr 13:

"OpenAI Non-Announcement: Requiring identity card verification for access to new API models and capabilities"

But always good to be on look out for shenanigans :)

Re: OpenAI dropped the price of o3 by 80%

#346

This is the best model out there, priced level or lesser than Claude and Gemini They’re not letting the competition breathe

Gemini is close (if not better) so it just makes sense no? o3-pro might be ahead of pack tho

o3 does better especially if you use the api (not ChatGPT)

Re: OpenAI dropped the price of o3 by 80%

#347
post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Before: 50 messages per week Now: 100 messages per week

That’s already been the case for a few weeks though, right? and it’s up from 50, whereas a price reduction by 80% would correspond to 5x the quota extrapolating linearly.

Agreed 100% o3 is great but the rate limit window and the quota itself both render it almost useless for more than one off fixes.

It's great with those, however!

Re: OpenAI dropped the price of o3 by 80%

#348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, our models are sometimes too lazy. It’s not intentional, and future models will be less lazy. When I worked at Netflix I sometimes heard the same speculation about intentionally bad recommendations, which people theorized would lower streaming and increase profit margins. It made even less sense there as streaming costs are usually less than a penny. In reality, it’s just hard to make perfect products! (I work…

Please be careful about the alternative. I’ve seen o3 doing excessive tool calls and research for relatively simple problems.

Yep, it defaults to doing a web search even when that doesn't make sense.

Example, I asked it to write something. And then I asked it to give me that blob of text in markdown format. So everything it needed was already in the conversation. That took a whole minute of doing web searches and what not.

I actually dislike using o3 for this reason. I keep the default to 4o. But sometimes I forget to switch back and it goes off boiling the oceans to answer a simple question. It's a bit too trigger happy with that. In general all this version and model soup is impossible to figure out for non technical users. And I noticed 4o is now sometimes starting to do the same. I guess, too many users never use the model drop down.

Re: OpenAI dropped the price of o3 by 80%

#349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is almost certainly what they're doing and rebranding the original o3 model as "o3-pro"

Nope, not what we’re doing. o3 is still o3 (no nerfing) and o3-pro is new and better than o3. If we were lying about this, it would be really easy to catch us - just run evals. (I work at OpenAI.)

Anecdotal, but about a week ago I noticed a sharp drop in o3 performance. For many tasks I will compare Gemini 2.5 Pro with o3, running the same prompt in both. Generally for my personal use o3 and G2.5P have been neck-and neck over the last months, with responses I have been very happy with.

However starting from a week ago, the o3 responses became noticeably worse, with G2.5P staying about the same (in terms of what I've come to expect from the two models).

This alongside the news that you guys have decreased the price of o3 by 80% does really make it feel like you've quantized the model or knee-capped thinking or something. If you say it is wholly unchanged I'll believe you, but not sure how else to explain the (admittedly subjective) performance drop I've experienced.

Re: OpenAI dropped the price of o3 by 80%

#350

Despite the popular take that LLMs have no moat and are burning cash, I find OpenAI's situation really promising. Just yesterday, they reported an annualized revenue run rate of 10B. Their last funding round in March valued them at 300B. Despite losing 5B last year, they are growing really fast - 30x revenue with over 500M active users. It reminds me a lot of Uber in its earlier years—fast growth, heavy investment, b…

The moat is increasingly becoming having access to billions needed to finance the infrastructure needed to serve billions. That's why Google is still in the game. They have that and they are very good at massive scale and have some cost advantages there.

OpenAI is very good at this as well because of their brand name. For many people ChatGPT is all they know. That's the one that's in the news. That's the one everybody keeps talking about. They have many millions of paying users at this point.

This is a non trivial moat. If you can only be successful by not serving most of the market for cost reasons, then you can't be successful. It's how Google has been able to guard its search empire for a quarter century. It's easy to match what they do algorithmically. But then growing from a niche search engine that has maybe a few tens of thousands of users (e.g. Kagi) to Google scale serving essentially most of this planet (minus some fire walled countries like Russia and China), is a bit of a journey.

So Google rolling out search integration is a big deal. It means they are readying themselves for that scale and will have billions of users exposed to this soon.

> Their last funding round in March valued them at 300B. Despite losing 5B last year, they are growing really fast

Yes, they are valued based on world+dog needing agentic AIs and subscribing to the extent of tens or hundreds of dollars/month. It's going to outstrip revenue things like MS Office in its prime.

5B loss is peanuts compared to that. If they weren't burning that, their ambition level would be too low.

Uber now has a substantial portion of the month. They have about 3-4 billion revenue per month. A lot of cost obviously. But they managed 10B profit last year. And they are not done growing yet. They were overvalued at some point and then they crashed, but they are still there and it's a pretty healthy business at this point and that reflects in their stock price. It's basically valued higher now than at the time of the Softbank investment pre-IPO. Of course a lot of stuff needed to be sorted out for that to happen.

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