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Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

nytimes.com

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Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#291

Post by rat87 »

NoMoreNicksLeft wrote: post #104
baggachipz wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If that's the case, you're an easily-duped sucker of a customer and deserve to lose your money.

[flagged]

Higher education is what made America rich and powerful and influential. Many immigrants who come to these schools stay there. Many others form positive links between their counties and the US. International students pay more and therefore subsidize American students. Kicking them out would likely increase the price, which is not a huge deal with Harvard but would be incredibly damaging if say he did this to all universities including state ones

Besides this is just Trump abusing and violating the law to go after his enemies. It could be anyone next including you. Impartial rule of law is one of the core aspects of a liberal democracy. It's one of the reasons we are better then corrupt Dictatorships. It's like Nixon but worse and more open. What we need is Trump and maga to be knocked down many pegs before they destroy our country (please remember you live here in the place Trump is destroying)

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#293

Post by chrisweekly »

HEmanZ wrote: post #24
ar813 wrote: post #10

If they can do this to Harvard, what hope do other universities have?

They’re trying to make an example of Harvard so they don’t need to force anyone else to tow the line. Other universities will self censor.

nit: fyi it's "toe the line"

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#294

Post by throwawaymaths »

firesteelrain wrote: post #227
achristmascarl wrote: post #25

I wonder what avenues there are for Harvard to challenge this; it looks like the mechanism the Trump Admin used was for the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) to cancel Harvard's Student and Exchange Visitor Program (SEVP) certification [0] which is managed by Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) [1]. Does ICE just have full discretion over SEVP? Can they do this to any school for whatever reason they want? […

Under 8 U.S.C. § 1372, the SEVIS (Student and Exchange Visitor Information System) program requires schools to report data on international students including what DHS has been asking for. Harvard may argue that DHS’s request was overly broad, lacked due process, or sought information beyond what the law permits. 8 CFR § 214.3(g) and § 214.4(b), which require schools to maintain and furnish records “as required by th…

yep. the laws have been written to be broad... my best guess would be the best legal argument Harvard could claim would be that it construes the existing law as a bill of attainder (a law targetted at an individual or group of individuals called out by person -- versus called out by some category of actions -- that is judged without trial)

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#295

Post by Spivak »

woggy wrote: post #266

I don't see the US surviving the Trump administration.

We basically get two chances if you want to follow the normal procedure. Swing congress during the midterms and lock him up for the remainder of his term and or elect a democrat in four years who will tear up the stack of executive orders and make the rounds apologizing to everyone.

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#296

Post by selfselfgo »

couchdb_ouchdb wrote: post #272
HenryBemis wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I downloaded the file (must still be somewhere in my "Downloads" folder with many other forever-unread PDFs). I would suggest for anyone living in the US, to find and read that because this is (more or less) what will happen in the/your country in the next 3.5 years. (if I remember well it's 150-170 pages - and since I don't live in the US the meme "Ain't Nobody Got Time for That" is spot on).

You don't need to read the file. It's history repeating itself. Just read about China during the cultural revolution or Cambodia during the 70s.

[dead]

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#297

Post by cherryteastain »

IAmBroom wrote: post #209
mperham wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn’t matter, the damage is done. If you’re an international student, are you going to risk an El Salvador gulag?

[flagged]

There were many recent instances of even long term US permanent residents being sent to immigration detention centers. Maybe El Salvador gulag is an exaggeration, but being sent to a squalid prison is a very real possibility. Here's one from yesterday [1]. What's preventing them from doing the same to a student?

Also, most people affected by this will not be the son/daughter of the president of a foreign country or a billionaire.

[1] https://www.newsweek.com/green-card-holder-detained-ice-immi...

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#298

Post by iambateman »

alaxhn wrote: post #228
scoofy wrote: post #8

If you are a Republican and didn’t sign up for this, can you please write your representatives about impeachment? This is getting ridiculous. We’d be much better off with a president Vance.

What is the better path forward? Republican voters led by their representative Trump were unhappy about certain policies and events at Ivy league institutions. Voters have the right to feel this way and elect representatives to carry out their views even if this is not how you feel as a feature of democracy. Proxies of the representatives of the voters reached out to a few institutions requesting changes to be made o…

Btw, I am a University employee who serves (among other things) children affected by parents who abuse drugs.

My organization employs hundreds of people working on everything from low income nutrition education to researching Medicaid expenditure.

We belong to the University, but we don’t have anything to do with undergraduate education.

This is the problem with looking at higher-Ed ratios like that…there are a lot of good things happening at a University which don’t reduce to “teacher in classroom.”

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#299

Post by josefresco »

decimalenough wrote: post #169
lupusreal wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I don't think the Trump admin gives a rat's ass about Jews. It's an excuse for legal action, in the same way that "fentanyl" was the excuse for tariffs on Canada.

Top donor in the last 3 elections (combined) to Trump is Adelson Clinic/Miriam Adelson. She didn't spend all that money for nothing.

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#300

Post by throwawaymaths »

mcphage wrote: post #146
ty6853 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The actual letter explains they can regain status by ratting out their students. It will quietly be done, although likely in a way that make it look as if Harvard hasn't.

> The actual letter explains they can regain status by ratting out their students. Trump's history has shown that if you cave into his demands, he doesn't leave you alone—instead he starts demanding even more, since he knows you'll fold.

can you give an example?
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