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First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV

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Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV

#701

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

snickerbockers wrote: post #676
afavour wrote: post #97

> "Cardinal George of Chicago, of happy memory, was one of my great mentors, and he said: 'Look, until America goes into political decline, there won't be an American pope.' And his point was, if America is kind of running the world politically, culturally, economically, they don't want America running the world religiously. So, I think there's some truth to that, that we're such a superpower and so dominant, they do…

That's an interesting thought but if they're actually that concerned about it then they'd wait longer than four months. It probably has more to do with America's predominant religion being protestantism by a very wife margin for most of the country's existence. We didn't have a Catholic president until Kennedy and even then proving to the common American that Catholics aren't insane Vatican mindslaves was considered…

> That's an interesting thought but if they're actually that concerned about it then they'd wait longer than four months.

I don't think they had much control over when Francis died.

Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV

#702

Post by refurb »

afavour wrote: post #97

> "Cardinal George of Chicago, of happy memory, was one of my great mentors, and he said: 'Look, until America goes into political decline, there won't be an American pope.' And his point was, if America is kind of running the world politically, culturally, economically, they don't want America running the world religiously. So, I think there's some truth to that, that we're such a superpower and so dominant, they do…

It’s funny seeing people talk about the decline of America. I can remember the same conversations in the 1970’s, late 2000’s as well.

Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV

#703

Post by Detrytus »

anonymars wrote: post #608
dragonwriter wrote: post #538

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait till you see how long Cardinal Pizzaballa who was viewed as the most likely Italian contender for the Papacy, has spent in the Holy Land and not Italy.

> Cardinal Pizzaballa Not going to lie, I had to check that this was a real name (it is)

I have a coworker right now whose name is Carmelo Martini. Seriously, I had to ask him: "did your parents name you after their favorite drink?".

Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV

#704

Post by bjornroque »

dmayle wrote: post #653
javiramos wrote: post #592

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

You could educate yourself, you know, instead of trying to regurgitate something that someone else said that you thought looked clever. What would you call Americans? United Statesians? There are two countries called the United States in North America, there's the United States of Mexico, and the United States of America. People from the United States of Mexico are called Mexicans, and people from the United States o…

[dead]

Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV

#705

Post by ToValueFunfetti »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #701
snickerbockers wrote: post #676

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's an interesting thought but if they're actually that concerned about it then they'd wait longer than four months. It probably has more to do with America's predominant religion being protestantism by a very wife margin for most of the country's existence. We didn't have a Catholic president until Kennedy and even then proving to the common American that Catholics aren't insane Vatican mindslaves was considered…

> That's an interesting thought but if they're actually that concerned about it then they'd wait longer than four months. I don't think they had much control over when Francis died.

The concern is that America would be too powerful if they had this power over Catholicism as well. There's no concern about waiting until it's time to appoint the next one.

Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV

#706

Post by thrance »

anthonymoose wrote: post #656
thrance wrote: post #569

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt so, Christian Republicans conveniently ignore the parts of the Bible that directly contradict their ideology. How else could J.D. Vance consider himself a Catholic when his actions so directly go against the teachings of Christ? More generally, I think religion doesn't really inform your political views. It can certainly reinforce them post-hoc, but it certainly isn't the basis of one's morality.

As a practicing Southern Baptist, I don’t find Vance’s political ideology contradicts Christ’s teachings. Could you provide some good exemplar backed by scripture please? Preferably not cherry picked lines that tacitly support your earthly ideology, please.

https://www.ncronline.org/opinion/guest-voices/jd-vance-wron...

https://christiansforsocialaction.org/resource/false-god-con...

You can find many more online easily, but I won't waste more of my time providing them to you, as I doubt your enquiry was completely honest.

Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV

#707

Post by grayfaced »

qsort wrote: post #27
blensor wrote: post #9

I wonder if there is any other event in recent history that is communicated as quickly to as many people as the fact that a new pope has been elected. I was out on the streets when the church bells started ringing here in Vienna as must have all around the globe where there are catholic churches

Probably not as spiritually fulfilling, but the stock market would be an example of that happening at sub-second latencies, every day, all day.

That message is sent quickly. But if you're talking about raw eyeballs, not many are reading it.

Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV

#708

Post by jkaplowitz »

toast0 wrote: post #633
jkaplowitz wrote: post #463

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's your source on that, at least in the case when the head of the foreign state also remains a US citizen? There's also the interesting question of whether he will remain a US citizen after all, or whether taking the office of pope will count as him relinquishing US citizenship under INA §349(a)(4): https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/visa-law0/L... In the latter case, the tax question would not aris…

That law states > A person who is a national of the United States whether by birth or naturalization, shall lose his nationality by voluntarily performing any of the following acts with the intention of relinquishing United States nationality— It would seem there would need to be an intention to relinquish; which I don't necessarily think is tacit in accepting the office of Pope.

Yes, there does need to be an intention to relinquish US nationality in order for US nationality to be lost. It doesn't have to be explicitly stated, but it does have to be there. If it ever needs to be disputed in court, whoever is arguing loss of citizenship (either the government or the would-be former citizen) has to prove that intent by the same standard of proof that's generally required to win a civil lawsuit, preponderance of the evidence aka more likely than not.

I agree it's not clear that accepting the papacy involves intent to relinquish, but it's not clear either way. The Department of State (at first instance) or any court who considers the matter (if a dispute arises) would normally consider the individual situation in order to conclude what they think is the intent.

In practice, if Trump and Rubio don't want an international incident, they will probably just ask the Vatican what the Pope intended and go along with that.

Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV

#709

Post by [deleted] »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #701
snickerbockers wrote: post #676

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's an interesting thought but if they're actually that concerned about it then they'd wait longer than four months. It probably has more to do with America's predominant religion being protestantism by a very wife margin for most of the country's existence. We didn't have a Catholic president until Kennedy and even then proving to the common American that Catholics aren't insane Vatican mindslaves was considered…

> That's an interesting thought but if they're actually that concerned about it then they'd wait longer than four months. I don't think they had much control over when Francis died.

[deleted]

Re: First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV

#710

Post by yazantapuz »

dmayle wrote: post #653
javiramos wrote: post #592

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

You could educate yourself, you know, instead of trying to regurgitate something that someone else said that you thought looked clever. What would you call Americans? United Statesians? There are two countries called the United States in North America, there's the United States of Mexico, and the United States of America. People from the United States of Mexico are called Mexicans, and people from the United States o…

Well, yes. In spanish we use "estadounidense" a lot.
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