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What Porn Did to American Culture?

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Re: What Porn Did to American Culture?

#91

Post by Jensson »

-__---____-ZXyw wrote: post #87
whatnow37373 wrote: post #35

Not buying it. She just states “porn shaped society” without anything to prove it. Seems absurd to me on the face of it. Are men objectifying women? Yes. Have they done this since the dawn of mankind? Yes. I could easily claim the reverse. Society shapes porn. It’s a reflection, not the other way around.

I think "society shapes porn" was totally true up until the point where it no longer was. Porn shapes society the exact moment when the majority of young people get the majority of their beliefs and views on sexuality, romance, relationships, gender roles, sensuality, etc, from porn. This isn't true of all groups of humans everywhere, but it's definitely true of many societies right now already, and I would say obvio…

There is so much porn that people watch what they want to watch rather than what they are fed, whatever you want to find you can find. So the only way it shapes society is that now people are aware of everything you can do in sex and what their preferences are, it doesn't create those preferences it just makes them known.

Re: What Porn Did to American Culture?

#92

Post by maroonblazer »

bradlys wrote: post #90
maroonblazer wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not the parent, but for me, porn served as a kind of supernormal stimulus. It became difficult to become aroused with my partner when I had a practically infinite variety of virtual women to choose from, doing an infinite variety of things. Quitting porn was one of the best things I did for my sex life.

I hear about this sometimes and I just wonder if the post-nut clarity makes you recoil. If I was finding my partner less attractive to the point of finding it challenging to become aroused around them, it certainly has more to do with them than it does with whatever I am watching. I’ve never experienced this even in the slightest and I’ve definitely had moments where I was unattractive to my partner and not having se…

It makes me recoil that I replaced my partner with simulacrum of her.

I've been in situations like the one you describe but this was not that. It's not about attractiveness. A good analogy is that you can sate your sweet tooth by eating certain fruits. But if you start binging candy bars and ice cream, suddenly that pineapple you used to love no longer does the job.

Re: What Porn Did to American Culture?

#93

Post by -__---____-ZXyw »

Jensson wrote: post #91
-__---____-ZXyw wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think "society shapes porn" was totally true up until the point where it no longer was. Porn shapes society the exact moment when the majority of young people get the majority of their beliefs and views on sexuality, romance, relationships, gender roles, sensuality, etc, from porn. This isn't true of all groups of humans everywhere, but it's definitely true of many societies right now already, and I would say obvio…

There is so much porn that people watch what they want to watch rather than what they are fed, whatever you want to find you can find. So the only way it shapes society is that now people are aware of everything you can do in sex and what their preferences are, it doesn't create those preferences it just makes them known.

Just like they listen to the music they want, watch the movies they want, buy the products they want, and go to the websites they want..?

I don't think it's true for porn or for any of the above things that people "do what they want" in any serious sense of the term.

It might be true in some sort of world without advertising, where media is presented neutrally, and barriers to creating and sharing (porn, music, plays, books, etc) are low, and we all explore and pick what we liked from these media sources in a deliberate, thoughtful way.

But that is so very, very far from the world we're in, surely?

Or a different way to make the point, just compare a pre-internet and post-internet kid. What did pre-internet kids know of sex when they were 14 or 15? And post-internet? This is a quick and easy example, but surely it's a major shift?

Re: What Porn Did to American Culture?

#94

Post by davidmurdoch »

davidmurdoch wrote: post #76
mystraline wrote: post #22

The article claims porn, and sure, that's a part. The bigger issue here is outmoded predominant protestant christian views of 'morality'. And that percolates all through the rest of USA culture, including into advertisements and commercialism. Their view of sex is as a sin, so its shamed, hidden, and secretly desired. All these things have popped up with all these pretty terrible results. Sexuality is 'tittalting' so…

> Their view of sex is as a sin Interesting perspective. But this is actually what Protestant Christians believe: https://ca.thegospelcoalition.org/columns/ad-fontes/5-surpri...

Even more interesting is that when shown irrefutable evidence of what Protestant Christians believe I am downvoted multiple times for showing it.

Re: What Porn Did to American Culture?

#95

Post by davidmurdoch »

swat535 wrote: post #84
davidmurdoch wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Their view of sex is as a sin Interesting perspective. But this is actually what Protestant Christians believe: https://ca.thegospelcoalition.org/columns/ad-fontes/5-surpri...

Right, there's a popular idea that Christianity is somehow anti-sex, but that's not really accurate if you look closely at the tradition itself. The Bible doesn't condemn sex, in fact, books like Song of Songs celebrate it in pretty vivid terms (just to name an example though one could dig up much more..). What Christianity actually critiques is sex outside of marriage. The reasoning is that sex is viewed as the most…

Yes, this.

Bizarre that I was downvoted for simply providing evidence. HN readers sure can be a strange bunch!

Re: What Porn Did to American Culture?

#96

Post by Jensson »

-__---____-ZXyw wrote: post #93
Jensson wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is so much porn that people watch what they want to watch rather than what they are fed, whatever you want to find you can find. So the only way it shapes society is that now people are aware of everything you can do in sex and what their preferences are, it doesn't create those preferences it just makes them known.

Just like they listen to the music they want, watch the movies they want, buy the products they want, and go to the websites they want..? I don't think it's true for porn or for any of the above things that people "do what they want" in any serious sense of the term. It might be true in some sort of world without advertising, where media is presented neutrally, and barriers to creating and sharing (porn, music, plays…

> Just like they listen to the music they want, watch the movies they want, buy the products they want, and go to the websites they want..?

Yes, people listen to a wider range of music and watch a wider range of videos than ever before today, because there is a wider range available.

Most people are drawn to the same kind of content though so many people consume very similar things.

Re: What Porn Did to American Culture?

#97

Post by giardini »

pseudalopex wrote: post #69
mystraline wrote: post #22

The article claims porn, and sure, that's a part. The bigger issue here is outmoded predominant protestant christian views of 'morality'. And that percolates all through the rest of USA culture, including into advertisements and commercialism. Their view of sex is as a sin, so its shamed, hidden, and secretly desired. All these things have popped up with all these pretty terrible results. Sexuality is 'tittalting' so…

> And really, everybody should at least try a sex party (Bacchanal) once. Have to do some std checks ahead of time, but its just so liberating and freeing for everyone. It gets money, possessiveness, prudishness, and all those distorting things out of the way. And puts sex into perspective. And well, its fun. https://xkcd.com/592/ Sex parties are liberating for some people. Not for others. People who go to sex partie…

pseudalopes says>" People who go to sex parties are not healthier or unhealthier in my experience."

There is no doubt whatsoever that people who go to sex parties or who have more sex partners are more likely to be diseased. It's just germ theory and simple numbers: the more sexual contacts you have the more diseases you will carry.

Anyone desirous of having children someday would probably want their offspring to be free of disease. Ergo, steer clear of disease and seek a partner who has done the same.

Re: What Porn Did to American Culture?

#98

Post by cryptonector »

whatnow37373 wrote: post #35

Not buying it. She just states “porn shaped society” without anything to prove it. Seems absurd to me on the face of it. Are men objectifying women? Yes. Have they done this since the dawn of mankind? Yes. I could easily claim the reverse. Society shapes porn. It’s a reflection, not the other way around.

Not sure the following is caused by or correlated with porn use, but it might be: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43813335 ? My guess is "correlated with", not "caused by". Or perhaps even "that causes porn of that"?

Re: What Porn Did to American Culture?

#99

Post by cryptonector »

thraway79879s8d wrote: post #68
mystraline wrote: post #22

The article claims porn, and sure, that's a part. The bigger issue here is outmoded predominant protestant christian views of 'morality'. And that percolates all through the rest of USA culture, including into advertisements and commercialism. Their view of sex is as a sin, so its shamed, hidden, and secretly desired. All these things have popped up with all these pretty terrible results. Sexuality is 'tittalting' so…

You're right, but I don't think "just go to a sex party" scales up. There is simply way more male interest in such things. (Though yes, a lot of men would chicken-out last minute too.) A gestalt of 3rd wave feminisism is "maybe if women are liberated, they will be hornier like men", and there was a huge amount of cultural messaging in this direction. It does not work, and as the interview entails, there is a lot of r…

If women are not happy with the hookup culture, then maybe you need to add one more option to your "either" list: marriage. I know that sounds quaint, but look around this thread and see that marriage need not mean monogamy, for a lot of people anyways, but stability (emotional, financial, familial, sexual).

Besides, your list comes across as very male-centered[0]: how do we provide men with all the sex they neeEeEeddd?? And oddly enough one answer to _that_ question is also marriage.

Now, there are unhappy sex-less married couples, so of course one question is how to address that. But at least in my and -as far as I can tell- my friends' experience marriage does provide men and women with the level of sexual activity that they need/want.

BTW, your (1) is probably happening as testosterone levels go down. Or at least one would expect that to be the case. If it is then you're getting your wish.

None of this is judging anyone.

[0] If your list is not male-centered, then it is still centered on this idea that sex parties are the bomb, but that's almost certainly not what most people think. I've a ton of close friends from all walks, many of them coupled, many not, and not one has ever even hinted that sex parties are a thing they care about, let alone come right out and said so.

Re: What Porn Did to American Culture?

#100

Post by Mikhail_Edoshin »

swat535 wrote: post #84
davidmurdoch wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Their view of sex is as a sin Interesting perspective. But this is actually what Protestant Christians believe: https://ca.thegospelcoalition.org/columns/ad-fontes/5-surpri...

Right, there's a popular idea that Christianity is somehow anti-sex, but that's not really accurate if you look closely at the tradition itself. The Bible doesn't condemn sex, in fact, books like Song of Songs celebrate it in pretty vivid terms (just to name an example though one could dig up much more..). What Christianity actually critiques is sex outside of marriage. The reasoning is that sex is viewed as the most…

Christianity is against superficial fast-sex surrogates. It is against any superficiality in general and calls for true devotion in everything you do.

(There is a movie I like, “Old-fashioned” (2004), that has a moment where the hero talks about “a perfect honeymoon”.)

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