US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s • Hacker News Board

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#651

Post by oezi » Sun, Mar 09, 2025, 5:34 PM UTC

davidmurdoch wrote: post #446

dashundchen wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trump/Musk/Republicans have taken the side of a fascist dictator Putin. Every recent move wrt Ukraine has benefitted Russia. Even if it means betraying democratic allies and decades long alliances. It is so shameful and disgusting.

Honestly curious what you, and proponents for continuing to arm Ukraine, think should be done about Russia's encroachment into Western Europe?

I am confused why you ask this of the proponents. The proponents think that Russia is performing horrendous war crimes and must be stopped from encroaching further. We see massacres such as Bucha where Russia had a couple of days and indiscriminately butchered innocent civilians and realized that there is no other way but to keep fighting to stop Russia from taking more territory and lives.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#652

Post by nabla9 » Sun, Mar 09, 2025, 5:35 PM UTC

Even if Trumpism is gone by 2028, nothing goes back to normal. We'll see the raise of ITAR-free weapons systems from Europe and Asian "former" US allies and cooperation around the US.

What Trump and MAGA people don't realize is that 11 carrier groups sailing around the seas alone are not that big a threat. Defence Cooperation Agreement (DCA) and Status of Forces Agreement (SOFA) provide unsinkable airfields, supply depots for the US all over the world. They are massive power multiplier for the US military.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#653

Post by tim333 » Sun, Mar 09, 2025, 5:35 PM UTC

dividedbyzero wrote: post #52

Today it's Ukraine and F35s, who and what will it be in a year? I suppose European governments are taking a long hard look at strategic dependencies on the US right now, like the whole economy running on top of Microsoft and Google and other US-made SaaS. If all of that went dark at once, I honestly don't know how some of the larger companies I know could keep operating. They all have fallbacks for critical infrastru…

I think so far F16s not F35s. Though you wonder if say the UK could use F35s in Ukraine without Trump trying to turn something off.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#654

Post by bayindirh » Sun, Mar 09, 2025, 5:35 PM UTC

ty6853 wrote: post #602

addicted wrote: post #578

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can any reasonable national leader justify building their military on American systems anymore? Especially now that the U.S. government is also talking about not living up to its NATO obligations. This is not gonna hurt the rest of the world. Defense is where the U.S. exports a lot. So cutting back on U.S. weaponry will only help other nations. The same is true of Tech. Currently the tech industry is global, but…

This is an inherent property of closed source proprietary weapons. Which is why gun owners like stuff like the gen3 glock and ar-15 as everyone knows how to make the parts and the open source blueprints are put into manufacture by a gazillion companies to the point PSA shitwagon can compete with a Colt and interchange most the parts. Maybe Europe should open source a fighter jet and let the world compete on how they'…

Europe's weaponry is already somewhat "open source". Many big things like aircraft and missile systems are designed and built with pan-European consortia. As a result, every country knows how to build these things.

Heck, even Italian Agusta sold some of their platforms to a NATO ally with build/iterate/export permissions...

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#655

Post by jpadkins » Sun, Mar 09, 2025, 5:35 PM UTC

Waterluvian wrote: post #216

I think this from French senator Claude Malhuret sums it up: This is a tragedy for the free world, but it’s first and foremost a tragedy for the United States. [President Donald] Trump’s message is that being his ally serves no purpose, because he will not defend you, he will impose more tariffs on you than on his enemies, and he will threaten to seize your territories, while supporting the dictators who invade you.…

[flagged]

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#656

Post by mullingitover » Sun, Mar 09, 2025, 5:37 PM UTC

Argonaut998 wrote: post #533

AlecSchueler wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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You mean: European militaries haven’t done their historical norm, which is starting wars that kill horrific numbers of civilians. The only serious militarized power in that side of Eurasia is Russia, and what are they doing? Killing horrific numbers of civilians.

Seems like the reasonable goal would be to embargo Russia until they disarm like the other adults in the region.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#657

Post by timbit42 » Sun, Mar 09, 2025, 5:37 PM UTC

tomohawk wrote: post #24

rich_sasha wrote: post #3

Right now every buyer of American kit is feverishly evaluating non-US alternatives. Seriously, America, this is like Brexit but 1000x. A voluntary decision, taken with gusto, to chop off arms and legs and ears and fingers and whatnot, cut off the deadwood, be light and free, a lone vessel on the ocean of prosperity, free of the burden of the stupid foreigners who are the sole reason why everything was going wrong.

[flagged]

More countries are already considering building nuclear deterrence for the past month or so.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#658

Post by drysine » Sun, Mar 09, 2025, 5:37 PM UTC

ta988 wrote: post #228

And the story continues. This means that no country will want to buy F16s. If you don't get support they are useless. They are eroding really fast the US shine and trust in the world. This is going to have a massive effect on the US economy, internal consumption will not save it. This is the end of an empire while its rich kings are golfing every weekend on the taxpayer dime using federal and local resources. I am re…

It's not the first time it happens. For example, in 2006 the US stopped supplying spare parts to F-16s it sold to Venezuela.[0] Oddly, other countries kept buying F-16s.

Or think about Boeing and Airbus stopping servicing the planes they sold to Russia. Other countries are still buying from them as if nothing happened.

[0] https://www.foxnews.com/story/venezuela-threatens-to-sell-f-...

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#659

Post by jppope » Sun, Mar 09, 2025, 5:37 PM UTC

gip wrote: post #599

addicted wrote: post #578

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can any reasonable national leader justify building their military on American systems anymore? Especially now that the U.S. government is also talking about not living up to its NATO obligations. This is not gonna hurt the rest of the world. Defense is where the U.S. exports a lot. So cutting back on U.S. weaponry will only help other nations. The same is true of Tech. Currently the tech industry is global, but…

Totally agree that Trump is trading long-term dominance for short-term gains. I think that in a few months, we will see the U.S. economy doing very well and somehow rebuilding its industrial base. In the long term, U.S. influence and wealth will make up a much smaller share of the world’s wealth than it does today.

In fairness, he's getting kind of old.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#660

Post by __loam » Sun, Mar 09, 2025, 5:38 PM UTC

eitland wrote: post #556

knubie wrote: post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes I'm sure the Danes are wishing they had purchased their fifth generation fighters from China or Russia instead.

Alternatively they could have went with not 5 generation, but still extremely good Gripen. It's electronic warfare capabilities have reportedly surprised Nato pilots in exercises before.

Gripen has an American engine and uses American licensed missiles.