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US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

ukrainetoday.org

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Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#601

Post by throwaway_20357 »

_t9ow wrote: post #269
throwaway_20357 wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sceptical. Recent movements in Germany point into the opposite direction or rather a continuation of wishful thinking. Yes, a lot of debt-funded defence investment is coming. They also promised some investment in "infrastructure". At the same time the debt increase will delay reforms that are overdue for 20 years and longer. There were already calls that, now, with all brakes off, we can increase rather than curb…

> There were already calls that, now, with all brakes off, we can increase rather than curb spending on the welfare state. I'm curious: Where can I read more about this? Which parties (and how many) are saying this? Is there any pushback from Merz?

One example is pensions. For demographic reasons the state pension system is underfunded for years, a situation that is projected to become worse. One solution would be to increase contributions which are already sky-high and make working or opening a business a lot less attractive in Germany. Another is to freeze pensions. Guess what happened? Germany's old government increased the contribution level starting in January this year [1]. Additional, a pension raise [2] has recently been announced and the newly-found debt will provide funding for additional benefits for pensioners [3]. It more and more feels like a gerontocracy.

[1] https://www.deutsche-rentenversicherung.de/DRV/DE/Ueber-uns-... [2] https://www.tagesschau.de/inland/innenpolitik/rentensteigeru... [3] https://www.t-online.de/nachrichten/deutschland/innenpolitik...

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#602

Post by ty6853 »

addicted wrote: post #578
ta988 wrote: post #228

And the story continues. This means that no country will want to buy F16s. If you don't get support they are useless. They are eroding really fast the US shine and trust in the world. This is going to have a massive effect on the US economy, internal consumption will not save it. This is the end of an empire while its rich kings are golfing every weekend on the taxpayer dime using federal and local resources. I am re…

How can any reasonable national leader justify building their military on American systems anymore? Especially now that the U.S. government is also talking about not living up to its NATO obligations. This is not gonna hurt the rest of the world. Defense is where the U.S. exports a lot. So cutting back on U.S. weaponry will only help other nations. The same is true of Tech. Currently the tech industry is global, but…

This is an inherent property of closed source proprietary weapons. Which is why gun owners like stuff like the gen3 glock and ar-15 as everyone knows how to make the parts and the open source blueprints are put into manufacture by a gazillion companies to the point PSA shitwagon can compete with a Colt and interchange most the parts.

Maybe Europe should open source a fighter jet and let the world compete on how they'll manufacture it.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#603

Post by alfiedotwtf »

verandaguy wrote: post #318
epistasis wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I always thought that the American Empire would be dismantled when it elected a leftist steeped in anti-imperialist ideology who wanted to better the world. Nope, turns out that the American Empire is being dismantled by something else entirely. A subset of the populace that feels jealous of those with more and scared of social change, reacting to try to hurt their fellow country men? A megalomaniac leader who is som…

The myth of how much harm "leftists" can do/are doing in the US is probably what got you all here. It's another McCarthyist boogeyman, and it's not even being sold well -- a lot of the marketing's just outright lies, and people are eating that up.

The funniest part is how MAGA are literally rabid against anyone left of Bret Baier while embracing the overtly obvious Russian propaganda to the point where you start feeling sorry for them when the outright repeat Russian talking points e.g. deep MAGA don’t care a single iota for about anything more than 20ft from the US shores (because America first!) and yet they will have the strongest and most deeply detailed opinions on Crimea lol

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#604

Post by blibble »

addicted wrote: post #578
ta988 wrote: post #228

And the story continues. This means that no country will want to buy F16s. If you don't get support they are useless. They are eroding really fast the US shine and trust in the world. This is going to have a massive effect on the US economy, internal consumption will not save it. This is the end of an empire while its rich kings are golfing every weekend on the taxpayer dime using federal and local resources. I am re…

How can any reasonable national leader justify building their military on American systems anymore? Especially now that the U.S. government is also talking about not living up to its NATO obligations. This is not gonna hurt the rest of the world. Defense is where the U.S. exports a lot. So cutting back on U.S. weaponry will only help other nations. The same is true of Tech. Currently the tech industry is global, but…

risk of war going hot aside, the long term effect of this is fantastic for the rest of the world's industries

AWS, GCP and Azure looked unbeatable a month ago

but today, if you're a government official in the UK, Poland or Germany, would you be recommending AWS as your cloud provider?

absolutely not

they now have massive geopolitical risks associated with them due to being under the control of the increasingly unstable and authoritarian US regime that will sacrifice 80 years of foreign policy and soft power for a soundbite on fox news

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#605

Post by goodluckchuck »

mystified5016 wrote: post #300
vagrantJin wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> The US is an actual sovereign state, with democratic leaders, acting on behalf of their constituencies. At no point in history has this ever been less true.

What are you implying? We had an election. People voted. What am I missing?

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#607

Post by rsynnott »

2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #339
samcheng wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The best explanation I've heard is that this (almost) half of the US population doesn't care if it hurts a bit, as long as it hurts the other half of the US population more.

My mental model is that it will hurt the S&P500 but benefit the working class.

It’ll hurt the S&P500, sure. Far less clear how it’d benefit the working class, tho. Like, how does that work? You’d expect a decline in economic activity (ie fewer jobs, and lower or negative wage growth for what jobs do exist), and an increase in prices. That doesn’t help anyone much except _arguably_ the predatory super-rich (who can buy stuff up cheap), but even then it’s not a clear win for them either.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#608

Post by watwut »

colechristensen wrote: post #508
epistasis wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I always thought that the American Empire would be dismantled when it elected a leftist steeped in anti-imperialist ideology who wanted to better the world. Nope, turns out that the American Empire is being dismantled by something else entirely. A subset of the populace that feels jealous of those with more and scared of social change, reacting to try to hurt their fellow country men? A megalomaniac leader who is som…

Calling Republicans jealous and afraid is a good way to make yourself feel better but very much misses the character of what's happening. The "I'm a superior son of a bitch" attitude of leftists is gross. Saying "they're just jealous" is something you tell children. What you're saying here is "we're better than everyone else and everyone else disagrees with my positions because they envy how awesome we are".

Oh please. Between "libtards" and "snowflakes" and general condescension and insults comming from the the right for years and years, it is getting really tiring when the same people suddenly become thin skinned.

For years we have been listening "fuck your feelings" coming from the right.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#609

Post by moduspol »

kilotaras wrote: post #518
moduspol wrote: post #390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually we just want the war in Ukraine to end. Hope that helps. There's a lot of bloviating from the chattering class about cozying up to Russia, but I've yet to hear a cogent alternative. And no, I don't think "endlessly funding Ukraine to a forever stalemate" qualifies.

I believe a big crux is in definition of "war ended". You (and Donald Trump) seem to be using "Ukraine and Russia stop shooting at each other right now", while Ukraine operates more under "Russia stops shooting at us for the foreseeable future, 20 years at least." Russia has previously broken a number of ceasefires and written agreements (including the infamous Budapest memorandum) and so Ukraine is not super trustin…

What Ukraine will accept is entirely dependent on how much funding they will get from foreign powers to continue their war effort.

I've had a lot of responses to my comment, yet I've seen no alternative ideas presented that will result in a different outcome. What is your plan for getting Russia to lose this war?

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#610

Post by jacquesm »

ssssvd wrote: post #593
RandyOrion wrote: post #161

When totalitarian governments all start applauding what you're doing, using what you're doing as a distraction from a bad domestic situation as well as a justification for their dictatorships, you should know that something is totally screwed up. Yes, I'm talking about the totalitarian governments of China and Russia.

[flagged]

How aboutism, is that a variation on whataboutism?
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