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US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

ukrainetoday.org

441–450 of 1001 posts

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> - The US will still be in NATO, and will still be actively committed to the alliance This is already gone: "US ‘to cease all future military exercises in Europe’" https://www.telegraph.co.uk/us/politics/2025/03/08/us-to-cea...

I wasn’t aware that Trumps term had ended after only three months.

Ah yes, we'll end our participation and pull out all troops and then send them all back, in opposite land.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#442

Right now every buyer of American kit is feverishly evaluating non-US alternatives. Seriously, America, this is like Brexit but 1000x. A voluntary decision, taken with gusto, to chop off arms and legs and ears and fingers and whatnot, cut off the deadwood, be light and free, a lone vessel on the ocean of prosperity, free of the burden of the stupid foreigners who are the sole reason why everything was going wrong.

Since when was the US in the European Union or even near Europe? How is it like Brexit in the slightest? Why is it the US's responsibility to finance and organize the majority of EU's defense? PS: I'm from and in Europe. I don't get why it is a good or logical thing that the US should be responsible for the majority of "Western" defense on our territory.

> I don't get why it is a good or logical thing that the US should be responsible for the majority of "Western" defense on our territory.

Read some history (everything geopolitics after the second world war), you should ask yourself why for 76 years that's exactly what the US did (and perhaps why this is the first time that question occurred to you).

It's because the relationship between Europe and the US is not a mutually beneficial one, the US benefited the most from its power and influence over western Europe, and that doesn't just apply to Europe. NATO and the roughly 128 military bases in 58 different countries don't exist because the US somehow likes to subsidize the military spending of these countries for some altruistic purpose, it exists because it strengthens US influence across the world.

That's soft power, and if it fails, it means war (in total 123 military conflicts since WW2). It's a less bloody alternative to make sure the US gets what it wants because its the stronger party in any geopolitical relationship.

That's the logic behind it. The same logic applies to military aid it gives to Egypt and Israel (that Trump continues to give).

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#443

Right now every buyer of American kit is feverishly evaluating non-US alternatives. Seriously, America, this is like Brexit but 1000x. A voluntary decision, taken with gusto, to chop off arms and legs and ears and fingers and whatnot, cut off the deadwood, be light and free, a lone vessel on the ocean of prosperity, free of the burden of the stupid foreigners who are the sole reason why everything was going wrong.

On the heels of 40-year old American kit demonstrating its capability against their biggest arms export competitor. What a reversal.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#444
post #228

And the story continues. This means that no country will want to buy F16s. If you don't get support they are useless. They are eroding really fast the US shine and trust in the world. This is going to have a massive effect on the US economy, internal consumption will not save it. This is the end of an empire while its rich kings are golfing every weekend on the taxpayer dime using federal and local resources. I am re…

The best explanation I've heard is that this (almost) half of the US population doesn't care if it hurts a bit, as long as it hurts the other half of the US population more.

Holy strawman, batman.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#445

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The best explanation I've heard is that this (almost) half of the US population doesn't care if it hurts a bit, as long as it hurts the other half of the US population more.

No, that's not it. I'm writing this from rural America in deep Trump territory, and people here are already struggling and have been for years. From their perspective they've been left out of the benefits of the global economy—the big cities and the coasts might be better off, but the middle of the country wants to go back to when they had opportunities and jobs for working class Americans. They're almost certainly w…

I did read "Hillbilly Elegy" and come from a rust-belt city with rural family.

I understand your perspective, but I don't think that explains most of Trump's actions. The (very valid!) critique of globalist profiteering you shared has been boiled down into something beyond economics and into tribalism.

I blame decades of right-wing media dominance on cable TV and rural radio.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#446

What’s the motivation, if the Russians have the strong cards in this upcoming peace negotiation the current administration feels the need to weaken the Ukrainian side equipment? Slice of the minerals?

Trump/Musk/Republicans have taken the side of a fascist dictator Putin. Every recent move wrt Ukraine has benefitted Russia. Even if it means betraying democratic allies and decades long alliances. It is so shameful and disgusting.

Honestly curious what you, and proponents for continuing to arm Ukraine, think should be done about Russia's encroachment into Western Europe?

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#447

Right now every buyer of American kit is feverishly evaluating non-US alternatives. Seriously, America, this is like Brexit but 1000x. A voluntary decision, taken with gusto, to chop off arms and legs and ears and fingers and whatnot, cut off the deadwood, be light and free, a lone vessel on the ocean of prosperity, free of the burden of the stupid foreigners who are the sole reason why everything was going wrong.

The best era ever to be selling French of German arms.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#448
post #355

I think this from French senator Claude Malhuret sums it up: This is a tragedy for the free world, but it’s first and foremost a tragedy for the United States. [President Donald] Trump’s message is that being his ally serves no purpose, because he will not defend you, he will impose more tariffs on you than on his enemies, and he will threaten to seize your territories, while supporting the dictators who invade you.…

[flagged]

Does the US have total control? They sure have wide influence, but influence is different from control. The power to take something diminishes when you use it.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#449
post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whether there is a kill switch or not is somewhat irrelevant. There is a larger than nonzero chance that there is a kill switch, and the US cannot be trusted anymore. So we have to assume there is a kill switch.

Lack of maintenance parts is just a kill switch with a timer. Jet Fighters need a lot of maintenance, they are not like cars. So a kill switch in software is not needed. If the US stops shipping parts, then it is only a matter of time before the Jet Fighters is an expensive paper weight.

Huge part of F35 (like the engine) is made in EU/UK. We could "kill switch" USA as well.

https://www.ft.com/content/1503a69e-13e4-4ee8-9d05-b9ce1f7cc...

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#450
post #228

And the story continues. This means that no country will want to buy F16s. If you don't get support they are useless. They are eroding really fast the US shine and trust in the world. This is going to have a massive effect on the US economy, internal consumption will not save it. This is the end of an empire while its rich kings are golfing every weekend on the taxpayer dime using federal and local resources. I am re…

I fully expect that in some near future the civilian infrastructure also will be de-coupled from USA in the name of national security by other nations.

At this very moment, Apple and Google have the ability to disable communications for billions of people. They can make computers and phones totally unusable. Not just some features but everything.

EU was trying to legislate around this risk by forcing companies to bring data on EU soil and open their platform to alternative providers. They always tried to be gentle with it as companies will claim that they are taken advantage of but as the things unfold at this pace I'm pretty sure that it EU and probably the rest of the world will be very heavy handed the moment there's an instance of US president or US tech oligarch decides to shut down group of people from their devices to teach them a lesson or to compel them into something like they did with military systems in Ukraine. I was afraid for years that people will be insulated into groups and the global community will be destroyed and now I feel like its happening.

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