I wonder if there's any chance of technology like Verifiable Credentials[0] getting any adoption because of these laws. I think there are legitimate use cases where you would want to say, "hey, some third-party authority can vouch for me that ____", and not reveal to the third party who's asking for verification and not reveal to the party requiring verification any other claim besides the specific one that they need (say, age in this case).
Age Verification Laws: A Backdoor to Surveillance
131–140 of 485 posts
Re: Age Verification Laws: A Backdoor to Surveillance
#132age verification should be backed into the browser and not into websites. parents should be able to access a (password protected) setting in any browser that can exclude some types of websites (like porn). governments should be free to go after any website not respecting that setting. but forcing the age-verification onto websites is just moronic.
I wouldn't say every browser, but the correct place for the policy is on the device of the parent who is demanding the special feature. Sites' obligations should be limited to basic disclosure of "this site might contain X" metadata. Benefits: 1. Orwellian abuse: No creepy-ass super-abuseable government panopticon knowing every goddamn service you've ever made an account on, with the ability to arbitrarily revoke the…
What if a site doesn't comply or lies? Who is enforcing this
Re: Age Verification Laws: A Backdoor to Surveillance
#133When the Internet was built there was an expectation of anonymity. But anonymity and privacy are not quite the same.
And in fact, the Internet is not anonymous or private, as there are multiple ways to track and surveil members of the general public.
IMO the next step in the Internet's evolution needs to be the authenticated internet. An Authenticated Internet pretty much removes all the security issues, since every connection is authenticated. And authentication doesn't necessarily mean you're not anonymous.
Right now the Internet has become the worst of both worlds - not private, not anonymous, and all the problems associated with that (insecure, spoonable, etc).
That's what the EFF has wrong: the Internet is already a backdoor to surveillance. They're trying to stick their finger in the dyke. But what needs to happen is to rebuild the whole thing.
Re: Age Verification Laws: A Backdoor to Surveillance
#134The Internet should be Unrated and thus Adults Only by default. Just like public spaces. (Would you allow an 8 year old to wander New York City unattended? Arguments can be made for more controlled spaces but...) Have a website and want the chance for kids to see it? Advertise in the headers that it's moderated and intended to be a given rating. Various indexers can pick that up. Complaints can be forward to relevant…
Here's a list of things that I wouldn't want the police to do, but should be done: - Kids should be in bed by 8. - They shouldn't light fires in the back yard. - They shouldn't run with knives. If someone tried to use my support for those things as a basis for 24/7 surveillance of bedrooms, back yards and knife drawers, they'd be insane.
Should be done? Lol. Talking about culture ethnocentrism taking to the extreme. No one forces you not to take your kid to bed at 8, or you for that matter. Stay out of my life.
The anglosphere is so full of authoritarian people wanting to get into people's lives and even when arguing against surveillance you think there's an agreeable common goal we should all strive to. No. We don't.
Re: Age Verification Laws: A Backdoor to Surveillance
#135[flagged]
Re: Age Verification Laws: A Backdoor to Surveillance
#136The Internet should be Unrated and thus Adults Only by default. Just like public spaces. (Would you allow an 8 year old to wander New York City unattended? Arguments can be made for more controlled spaces but...) Have a website and want the chance for kids to see it? Advertise in the headers that it's moderated and intended to be a given rating. Various indexers can pick that up. Complaints can be forward to relevant…
Public spaces are most definitely not "Adults Only" by default. You're not allowed to have a big billboard with porn on it, you have to show ID to get into a bar, you have to show ID to buy a pack of cigarettes, and in many states the cigarettes have to be in an opaque cabinet. You can't walk around naked. You can't be drunk in public. Now admittedly many of these things are unevenly enforced, but society absolutely…
Nuanced difference: Everyone _has_ to traverse all of public to get anywhere, hence 'decency laws' so parents can take kids around without blindfolds.
You're taking the metaphor a bit too literally.
Re: Age Verification Laws: A Backdoor to Surveillance
#137When the Internet was built there was an expectation of anonymity. But anonymity and privacy are not quite the same. And in fact, the Internet is not anonymous or private, as there are multiple ways to track and surveil members of the general public. IMO the next step in the Internet's evolution needs to be the authenticated internet. An Authenticated Internet pretty much removes all the security issues, since every…
No. You want it because you want "total security" to feel safe but your authoritarian world doesn't make me and others feel safe. Thankfully, the government wants the power so they'll use it against dissidents when it matters hence you'll get a semblance of your way.
You can't block technology though. Government or not. People find a way.
Re: Age Verification Laws: A Backdoor to Surveillance
#138Earlier quoted context omitted.
>homeless people doing anything from drugs to defecating on the sidewalk right next to big tech's offices And this harms people how?
Littering degrades the commons.
In rural areas animals shit all over farms and areas where people exist and commingle
Re: Age Verification Laws: A Backdoor to Surveillance
#139Earlier quoted context omitted.
IMO slippery slope is a fallacy when the small step only supports the big step symbolically, shifting the “Overton Window”. It’s true that the Overton Window has some effect, but we shouldn’t avoid taking a step towards the middle just because it’s also a step towards the opposite bad side, if the middle is good. Wrt. privacy, the real issue is that the small step helps the big step not just symbolically. ID-based ag…
IMO the problem isn't ID-based age verification specifically, it's that such verification is usually impelemnted in a way where the service in question gets a lot more data than they need, with no real control over how that data is kept and processed. It would absolutely be possible to implement that stuff in a fully privacy-preserving way, with nothing but basic cryptography, and the government could absolutely enfo…
Yeah, the whole “we have to scan your driver’s license” which has my name, address, etc., encoded is way more than I want to share. I am mostly bald and even my beard is gray. There is no plausible situation where you think I might be under 21.
Re: Age Verification Laws: A Backdoor to Surveillance
#140It does sounds like that the author is not aware of existence of zero knowledge range proofs for identity based authetification (anonymous credentials). In essence they work as follows: a third party vouches a commitment for your birth year into a commitment with a signature. This then can be used for to be shown to a service provider along with a range proof to ensure that the age limit gets respected. That way service provider does not learn your year while can ensure that all members respect some required age limit.