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Always go to the funeral (2005)

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Re: Always go to the funeral (2005)

#281

Post by mmooss »

seanhunter wrote: post #184
cobbaut wrote: post #177

Please visit people when they are still alive. My aunt was alone for the last three years of her live, up to 94 years old. She had almost no visitors, and was not able to go out by herself. I went there about every week, and was always the only visitor. Then came the funeral, with well over 400 people there, and around 200 people at the coffee table after the funeral. And I was like: Where the hell were you guys the…

^ this. Also, don't allow yourself to be put off by the idea that you don't know what to say or whatever. Just go. If you think it's hard for you it's doubly hard for the person who is dying and noone is visiting them because they don't know what to say. My cousin was in hospital dying of cancer. I spoke to my mum and she said she wasn't sure what to say etc, so she ended up not going. I went. I said to him "hey this…

You don't need to say anything. Be present: listen; be curious and caring and compassionate and infinitely patient. Watch TV together; listen to music.

Re: Always go to the funeral (2005)

#282

Post by mmooss »

miroljub wrote: post #193
cobbaut wrote: post #177

Please visit people when they are still alive. My aunt was alone for the last three years of her live, up to 94 years old. She had almost no visitors, and was not able to go out by herself. I went there about every week, and was always the only visitor. Then came the funeral, with well over 400 people there, and around 200 people at the coffee table after the funeral. And I was like: Where the hell were you guys the…

People didn't go to visit her while being alive because they genuinely didn't care about her, or didn't care enough to bother to visit. They showed up in a funeral not because of her, but because they were afraid of what others would say about them if they didn't show up. This is the sad reality of human behaviour in this day and age.

What is that based on? You don't know these people, many individuals with their own stories and needs and troubles and drives.

Re: Always go to the funeral (2005)

#283

Post by bumby »

mmooss wrote: post #281
seanhunter wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

^ this. Also, don't allow yourself to be put off by the idea that you don't know what to say or whatever. Just go. If you think it's hard for you it's doubly hard for the person who is dying and noone is visiting them because they don't know what to say. My cousin was in hospital dying of cancer. I spoke to my mum and she said she wasn't sure what to say etc, so she ended up not going. I went. I said to him "hey this…

You don't need to say anything. Be present : listen; be curious and caring and compassionate and infinitely patient. Watch TV together; listen to music.

This is one of my biggest takeaways from reading Frank Ostaseski's book "The Five Invitations". He runs a hospice center and has lots of experience helping the dying and those around them. He talks about how being present is often what is most needed.

He also has a great talk with Sam Harris that's worth a listen.

Re: Always go to the funeral (2005)

#284

Post by bumby »

CooCooCaCha wrote: post #271
georgebcrawford wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's really harsh. Grief affects people in different ways. It can be overwhelming.

[flagged]

"Get over it" is rarely helpful in these types of situations because it ignores a lot of what we know about human psychology and how people make decisions. It's like telling someone who's depressed to "get over it"; it's not likely to help and often makes things worse.

Re: Always go to the funeral (2005)

#285

Post by jacobgkau »

mulmen wrote: post #268
freedomben wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, anecdotally I think there's an epidemic of uncaring going on in the world right now. I think the hyper-connectivity of always-on internet-based and smartphone-based stuff just overwhelms our capacity to care, but that's purely a theory.

> I think there's an epidemic of uncaring going on in the world right now. That’s like, your opinion man. You are in control of that. Such a negative view is a choice . You can focus on something positive instead. Our connected world allows families to stay in touch with almost zero friction. I get multiple updates weekly on my nieces and nephews even though they live hundreds of miles away. I have hundreds of photos…

> I think the hyper-connectivity of always-on internet-based and smartphone-based stuff just overwhelms our capacity to care, but that's purely a theory.

GP stated explicitly they have a theory about something that is causing people to behave differently. You can call that an opinion if you'd like. You can not believe the theory and instead blame that person's "choice," which is also "your opinion man." Your anecdote isn't very relevant to the theory in a thread full of people talking to the contrary.

Re: Always go to the funeral (2005)

#286

Post by mattl »

colanderman wrote: post #212
mattl wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the wake is more of a Catholic thing perhaps?

Maybe (I was raised Catholic), but I also attended a wake of a teacher of mine who was Jewish (culturally if not religiously). Thinking more now, where I'm from (northeast US), "wake" and "calling hours" are synonymous, whereas they might not be in other parts of the world. So I may be perpetuating some confusion of terms.

I think in parts of the US that's certainly true. Northeast US is predominantly Catholic too.

Re: Always go to the funeral (2005)

#287

Post by bumby »

sgt101 wrote: post #109
wvlia5 wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it's a somewhat odd custom no? Funerals. Probably no one stood up to talk because it felt awkward, as it is. It's not like you hurt your friends feelings for not speaking up.

It was my failure that hurt me, I think.

It's okay to give yourself some reprieve. People are often not in their right mind when grieving.

It's that time of year when It's a Wonderful Life shows up on TV. Have you ever seen the scene in the boardroom just after Jimmy Stewart's character's father died and left him the Building & Loan business? If you look closely, he's wearing a black arm band. That used to be customary as a way to signaling to people "I'm grieving, so please forgive me if I'm not in my right mind. Take what I say and do with a grain of salt."

When I die, I would not want my friends to feel worse by regretting something they did or didn't do. I'm willing to bet your friend loved you enough to feel the same way.

Re: Always go to the funeral (2005)

#288

Post by wvlia5 »

bowsamic wrote: post #137
wvlia5 wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Think in what specifically, example? I don't see what else I should think of.

Socially, i.e. about other people?

A yes, but it's odd to me that other people want me to be at a funeral with them.

If we have a great relationship, I can lend you money, share my house, get you a date, do some errands for you, take you to a party, listen to your thoughts and give you feedback. All valuable things I can do for you regardless of my funeral attendance. But just standing at a funeral? I don't see how is that valuable. Maybe for the chat, but we can have the chat anywhere else, like staring at the stars in a park, a superior setting.

And if we don't have a good relationship, well, then it doesn't matter what you want.

Re: Always go to the funeral (2005)

#289

Post by wvlia5 »

jll29 wrote: post #153
wvlia5 wrote: post #105

I think I won't go to my parents funeral (when the time comes). I don't see the value of standing next to their corpses. I didn't go to my grandma funeral, I don't regret it. I regret not having had deeper relationship with her. Same with my parents. Will have many regrets, but I believe not saying goobye to their corpses won't be one.

Fix your points of regret while this is still possible. If you do so, you will find that very likely, you will want to go once successful.

I believe we got to a point where it's them who have the responsibility to do the fixing.

Re: Always go to the funeral (2005)

#290

Post by bowsamic »

wvlia5 wrote: post #288
bowsamic wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Socially, i.e. about other people?

A yes, but it's odd to me that other people want me to be at a funeral with them. If we have a great relationship, I can lend you money, share my house, get you a date, do some errands for you, take you to a party, listen to your thoughts and give you feedback. All valuable things I can do for you regardless of my funeral attendance. But just standing at a funeral? I don't see how is that valuable. Maybe for the chat…

Do you have a social disorder of some kind? I feel that to most humans this is just immediately obvious and socially natural
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