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ChatGPT Search

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Re: ChatGPT Search

#291

Been thinking about this a lot [1]. Will this fundamentally change how people find and access information? How do you create an experience so compelling that it replaces the current paradigm? The future promised in Star Trek and even Apple's Knowledge Navigator [2] from 1987 still feels distant. In those visions, users simply asked questions and received reliable answers - nobody had to fact-check the answers ever. C…

> In those visions, users simply asked questions and received reliable answers - nobody had to fact-check the answers ever. This also seems like a little ridiculous premise. Any confident statement about the real world is never fully reliable. If star trek were realistic the computer would have been wrong once in a while (preferably with dramatically disastrous consequences)—just as the humans it likely was built aro…

This feels like hyperbole to me. People can reasonably expect Wikipedia to have factual data even though it sometimes contains inaccuracies. Likewise if people are using ChatGPT for search it should be somewhat reliable.

If I'm asking ChatGPT to put an itinerary together for a trip (OpenAI's suggestion, not mine), my expectation is that places on that itinerary exist. I can forgive them being closed or even out of business but not wholly fabricated.

Without this level of reliability, how could this feature be useful?

Re: ChatGPT Search

#292
Still do not like that ChatGPT does not want to provide sources to the answers.

I provided a query to a _somewhat_ common question with Java apps and TLS:

Query:

> identify root cause of this Java exception: PKIX path building failed: sun.security.provider.certpath.SunCertPathBuilderException: unable to find valid certification path to requested target

Answer:

> The exception you're encountering, PKIX path building failed, typically indicates an issue with SSL/TLS certificate validation. Specifically, the error unable to find valid certification path to requested target suggests that the Java application cannot find a trusted certificate for the server it is trying to connect to. Here are the common root causes and solutions:

Missing Certificate in Truststore: The server's SSL certificate (or the certificate of its issuing authority) is not present in the Java truststore. Solution: Import the server's certificate into the Java truststore using the keytool command. You can obtain the certificate by using a browser or tools like openssl. Self-Signed Certificate: If the server is using a self-signed certificate, it won't be trusted by default. Solution: Again, import the self-signed certificate into the Java truststore. Incorrect Truststore Configuration: The application might be pointing to an incorrect truststore or not configured to use one at all. Solution: Ensure the application is configured to use the correct truststore and that the path is correctly set. Expired Certificate: The certificate used by the server might be expired. Solution: Check the server's certificate validity and renew it if necessary. Intermediate Certificates Missing: If the server's certificate chain is incomplete (i.e., missing intermediate certificates), it can lead to this error. Solution: Ensure that the complete certificate chain is presented by the server or manually import any missing intermediate certificates. Network Issues: There may be issues with the network or firewalls blocking access to the certificate validation services. Solution: Check network configurations and ensure proper access. To troubleshoot further, you can enable Java SSL debugging by adding the following JVM argument:

bash Copy code -Djavax.net.debug=ssl This will provide more detailed output regarding the SSL handshake and help identify the specific issue.

It’s not a bad suggestion, these are my usual go-tos when diagnosing cause.

But then a query into what the sources are for this information is:

> The information is based on common knowledge about Java security, SSL/TLS configurations, and best practices for handling certificates. It reflects general principles and troubleshooting steps recognized in Java development and security documentation. If you're looking for specific references, the Oracle documentation on Java security and the keytool command, as well as community forums and resources on SSL/TLS issues, often cover these topics.

“It’s just common knowledge bro. RTFM”

Re: ChatGPT Search

#293
post #276
post #183

If the current iteration of search engines are producing garbage results (due to an influx of garbage + SEO gaming their ranking systems) and LLMs are producing inaccurate results without any clear method proposed to correct them, why would combining the two systems not also produce garbage? The problem I see with search is that the input is deeply hostile to what the consumers of search want. If the LLM's are partic…

I’d be more cynical still and ask, where is correct information found in the first place? Humans of all shape and size have biases. Most research is faulty, fabricated, or not reproducible. Missing information tells a greater story than existing one. We don’t have a way of finding objective information, why would we be able to train a model to do so?

Right now I basically can't find anything, the bar isn't "objective information" but "somewhat useful information". Google search quality became so bad we're past the debate of objective or subjective already, I'd be happy enough to get non-spam results.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#294
what time is it?

>Currently, I don’t have access to real-time data like time and date. You can check the time on your device or search "current time" online for the latest local time wherever you are.

Oh dear, we're off to a bad and slow start already.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I can pretty quickly tell a site is SEO spam, so should the LLM, no? Of course that would just start a new round in the SEO arms race, but could work for a while.

The LLM is not a human and cannot distinguish between spam and high quality content.

It seems pretty trivial to fine tune a model to do this - this is really playing to LLM's strengths.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#297

Been thinking about this a lot [1]. Will this fundamentally change how people find and access information? How do you create an experience so compelling that it replaces the current paradigm? The future promised in Star Trek and even Apple's Knowledge Navigator [2] from 1987 still feels distant. In those visions, users simply asked questions and received reliable answers - nobody had to fact-check the answers ever. C…

It is so absurd having to spend so much energy on "what happened on the football match yesterday" just because the internet is a wasteland full of ads.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#298

Been thinking about this a lot [1]. Will this fundamentally change how people find and access information? How do you create an experience so compelling that it replaces the current paradigm? The future promised in Star Trek and even Apple's Knowledge Navigator [2] from 1987 still feels distant. In those visions, users simply asked questions and received reliable answers - nobody had to fact-check the answers ever. C…

I use the “web search” bot on Poe.com for general questions these days, that I previously would have typed into Google (Google’s AI results are sometimes helpful though). It is better than GPT (haven’t tried TFA yet though), because it actually cites websites that it gets answers from, so you can have those and also verify that you aren’t getting a hallucination.

Besides Poe's Web Search, the other search engine I use, for news but also for points of view, deep dive type blog type content, is Twitter. Believe it or not. Google search is so compromised today with the censorship (of all kinds, not just the politically motivated), not to mention Twitter is just more timely, that you miss HUGE parts of the internet - and the world - if you rely on Google for your news or these other things.

The only time I prefer google is when I need to find a pointer/link I already know exists or should exist, or to search reddit or HN.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#299

is this going to give me lyrics or recipes link or will these categories continue to be nerfed by openai? it appears to write over its response of providing me a website link and gives me an unclickable blue name of website instead.

Lyrics aren't possible due to copyright restrictions (according to ChatGPT). I wonder what else won't be easy to find on here.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#300
This is probably Google's Altavista moment, by making their results crappier by the year in search of Ad dollars everyone has felt that there is a potential for search to be better and once that becomes available they'll be in a continious game of catch-up.

Yes, Google has their own AI divisions, tons of money and SEO is to blame for part of their crappiness. But they've also _explicitly_ focused on ad-dollars over algorithmic purity if one is to believe the reports of their internal politics and if those are true they have probably lost a ton of people who they'd need right now to turn the ship around quickly.

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