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Show HN: HTML for People

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Re: Show HN: HTML for People

#181

Post by theoldways »

rectang wrote: post #174
_lvbh wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's crazy how bad the mobile epidemic has gotten. There are kids coming into a Computer Science degree that can't figure out how to unzip a zip or even finding out where files get downloaded to. (Fwiw, those I know dropped out before 2nd year)

> It's crazy how bad the mobile epidemic has gotten. It's crazy how well mobile's robust security model has protected the suddenly computing masses.

We need freedom, not paternalism. And yet, somehow, despite this nanny state utopia, my data gets leaked approximately once every 17 minutes. Security my entire ass.

Re: Show HN: HTML for People

#182

Post by theoldways »

lemonberry wrote: post #149

This is great, but most people don't care about coding or building their websites for scratch. Most people don't work on their own cars. Authors don't bind their own books. People want to share their thoughts, stories, and photos. In my opinion, we need better tools to allow people to create their own sites without needing to code.

People who don't care can continue to not read the things they don't want to read. But those same people should be prepared to pay money for someone else to care for them. This is not a new situation.

Re: Show HN: HTML for People

#183

Post by asoneth »

simonw wrote: post #58
asoneth wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The decision to skip CSS by depending on https://simplecss.org/ is smart I was always a little disappointed with how most web browsers choose to render HTML pages that had no explicit styling information. I'm not necessarily saying web browsers should have defaults as opinionated as simple.css, but the default page margins, padding, text styles, headings, etc that they picked aren't particularly attractive. Opinion…

That's a historic artifact. If a browser shipped new default CSS today it would break 30+ years of existing web pages.

Oh absolutely, that ship has long since sailed, it's just me lamenting a world that could have been if something closer to simple.css or tufte-css had been the norm.

Though with "reader mode" becoming more popular I wonder if there's a place for a browser with more opinionated defaults.

Re: Show HN: HTML for People

#184

Post by theoldways »

RheingoldRiver wrote: post #123

> Step 1. Create a folder on your computer I don't need to read farther than this, I'm never going to recommend this over freecodecamp. Let alone that a lot of people are usually on mobile during learning time, it just makes it too scary, too easy to mess up, too hard to share what you are doing to get help. I 100% believe online sandboxes are the way to teach coding to people who aren't already comfortable with tech…

Should we get rid of the keyboard, too? After all, it's so complicated.

Re: Show HN: HTML for People

#185

Post by theoldways »

prmoustache wrote: post #133
RheingoldRiver wrote: post #123

> Step 1. Create a folder on your computer I don't need to read farther than this, I'm never going to recommend this over freecodecamp. Let alone that a lot of people are usually on mobile during learning time, it just makes it too scary, too easy to mess up, too hard to share what you are doing to get help. I 100% believe online sandboxes are the way to teach coding to people who aren't already comfortable with tech…

So basically you want to train a generation of copy/paster who don't understand what they are actually doing and who will never actually deploy anything because it is scary.

Hey, at least those of us who can actually hack it will never run out of messes to bill time and a half to clean up!

Re: Show HN: HTML for People

#186

Post by theoldways »

RheingoldRiver wrote: post #127
poulpy123 wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I strongly disagree, someone who create a web site or learn to program needs to know the basic of the basic of using a computer

it's not about knowing the basics of using a computer, it's about eliminating the possibility of tiny mistakes like 1 typo in a file name causing everything to break, which can put someone off coding forever

I'm sorry, but I learned on a garbage Windows 98 machine when I was like... seven, and I actually got quite far without someone padding the entire computer and handwringing about f*cking _typos_. My god, what happened to this industry? Yes, learning is hard! Sometimes you make mistakes! That is how you learn! This is why my coworkers submit garbage pull requests full of obvious errors, because they've been coddled to death and never allowed to accidentally typo a directory name. Christ...

Re: Show HN: HTML for People

#187

Post by blakewatson »

aardvark179 wrote: post #5

Why, “Start coding already!” rather than something like, “Start writing already?” I think half the barrier to people building sites is that they think they need to know how to code, and that seems scary, but they do know what they want to write, and that seems more approachable.

I went with "Get started already" :)

Re: Show HN: HTML for People

#188

Post by monkeynotes »

Don't coding LLMs kind of fill this gap? I can't imagine anyone who isn't a pro wanting to spend time learning HTML when they can just describe what they want in plain text and get something good enough.

Re: Show HN: HTML for People

#189

Post by skydhash »

bo1024 wrote: post #69
giobox wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I try not to get overly-annoyed at this kind of thing too, but to me it just demonstrates an incredible lack of self-drive, or curiosity, especially in the CS domain. If the students are genuinely curious, there is nothing to stop them learning about pretty much any topic in CS - really. There are few university subjects where the entire syllabus is freely available online in almost every format imaginable the way CS…

Are you sure they have a computer (i.e. something with a keyboard and a filesystem that it is possible to write and run programs on) at home?

That’s the easiest thing to get ahold of. You can find them for cheap on ebay.

Re: Show HN: HTML for People

#190

Post by skydhash »

dockd wrote: post #52
giobox wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I try not to get overly-annoyed at this kind of thing too, but to me it just demonstrates an incredible lack of self-drive, or curiosity, especially in the CS domain. If the students are genuinely curious, there is nothing to stop them learning about pretty much any topic in CS - really. There are few university subjects where the entire syllabus is freely available online in almost every format imaginable the way CS…

To keep that line of reasoning going, what is the purpose of the university, if you're supposed to learn everything on your own?

Access to mentors, books, peers, and recognition after graduating?
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