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Linux from Scratch

linuxfromscratch.org

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Re: Linux from Scratch

#72

Post by f0e4c2f7 »

Building using LFS has been on my list of "I really should probably do that just to learn" for about 20 years now. I'll get around to it! This year I'm finally learning Lisp (and really enjoying it).

Re: Linux from Scratch

#73

Post by andrewmcwatters »

I remember trying to automate non-distribution builds of a functional GNU/Linux operating system and trying to not read Linux from Scratch but just official kernel.org documentation.[1]

Unfortunately, the state of Linux documentation is so poor, you can't do it. You need to reference a number of third-party articles that kernel.org itself sometimes links you to.

I believe kernel.org might also mention Linux from Scratch, but LFS does a very poor job of explaining why you need particular dependencies straight out of initramfs.

You need a functional shell, and you need to get your installation on to an actual drive. Neither of those things are explained in sufficient detail with the current documentation available today.

LFS at best says "throw in these ingredients," and leaves you with no other information. You can probably read man pages and piece this stuff together, but it requires that you, at the very least, hardcode where to install files with fsck/mount/cp, I think.

Edit: LFS also does a really poor job of explaining why it chooses its "Basic System Software," much of which isn't actually required for a common GNU/Linux system.

[1]: https://github.com/andrewmcwatters/linux-workflow

Re: Linux from Scratch

#75

Post by andrewmcwatters »

kobalsky wrote: post #47
sieste wrote: post #3

I really like the idea, really tried following the process several times. But each time it just turned into a copy-incomprehensible-commands-into-the-terminal exercise at some point, and I lost motivation. Did anyone experience the same?

I grabbed a random page from the manual: https://www.linuxfromscratch.org/lfs/view/stable-systemd/cha... Every step is explained and every used parameter is documented.

You grabbed a random page.

Re: Linux from Scratch

#76

Post by bee_rider »

chgs wrote: post #68
bee_rider wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno. I’m a millennial so all sorts of stuff was just ascribed to my generation. As a result, I tend to just assume these differences are overstated. I worked with college students fairly recently. They did often reach reflexively for video. But when the written material was good enough, they used it.

Us millenials are old. My 43rd birthday is coming up fast. College students are the next generation. Most millenials remember dialup or at most a time before mainstream streaming video. College students today have seen their formative years being constantly on with instant access to more material in any format they want than they could ever grasp the concept of.

Yeah, I was just abstracting from the experience of having everything I did attributed to my generation, and then applying that experience to the next generation.

They handle some things a little differently and sometimes reach for different defaults, but in the end, it isn’t like they are coming from some totally alien planet or anything like that.

Re: Linux from Scratch

#77

Post by ngneer »

This brings back memories. I built LFS on a Pentium based machine a few times and it was quite fun. I took a similar approach to building a custom bare metal system for a client that needed extra security. I sometimes wish that there was a well maintained bare bones distribution inspired by the LFS philosophy, that might help with managing complexity on the cloud. Scanning the thread, NixOS came up. I used to love Slack, too. Any other recommendations? Something with minimal dependencies yet capable of being a LAMP-like server?

Re: Linux from Scratch

#78

Post by f0e4c2f7 »

theanonymousone wrote: post #74
f0e4c2f7 wrote: post #72

Building using LFS has been on my list of "I really should probably do that just to learn" for about 20 years now. I'll get around to it! This year I'm finally learning Lisp (and really enjoying it).

Isn't an LLM making such things more approachable?

For sure. It's been amazing honestly and I feel like it has really accelerated my learning. Enough that I'm trying to get really serious about making the most out of this new leverage seemingly out of nowhere.

I use it a lot for mapping out of the initial concepts but I find one of the best use cases is after understanding the basics, explaining where I need to learn more and asking for a book recommendation. The quality of my reading list has gone up 10x this way and I find myself working through multiple books a week.

Great for code too obviously, though still feels like early days there to me.

Re: Linux from Scratch

#79

Post by krylon »

Back in the day, I made an attempt at LFS but gave up halfway through. In my defense, I had done a gentoo stage 1 emerge earlier that year. ;-)

I never intended to end up with a usable system, I was just in it for the learning experience. And I did end up learning a lot.

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