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Please stop putting cookie pop-ups on your website (2022)

olivergrimsley.com

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Re: Please stop putting cookie pop-ups on your website (2022)

#121

Post by Ferret7446 »

matheusmoreira wrote: post #100
simonbarker87 wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The vast majority of websites just want to know where their visitors are coming from and, if they are selling a product, some aggregate level of demographic knowledge to tailor their marketing efforts. They really don’t care about an individual or even small cohort and aren’t selling the data on. Targeting advertising is sooo much more effective for small and medium sized businesses and actually makes many businesses…

It doesn't matter what they want. It doesn't matter why they want it. They are not entitled to this information. They should not be able to know anything at all about us without our explicit consent. We should not have to sacrifice our privacy and peace of mind so that businesses can succeed. If they can't succeed without surveilling us and selling us out, then let them go bankrupt.

And you aren't entitled to visit their website. Seems like everything is working fine then? Most of them won't go bankrupt just because you stop visiting; based on reality, most of them are doing relatively fine.

Re: Please stop putting cookie pop-ups on your website (2022)

#122

Post by Ferret7446 »

f1refly wrote: post #107
redprince wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That there is no such mechanism can be explained pretty well with this extreme scenario: - Browsers would come with the no tracking signal enabled by default (why wouldn't they?) so that tracking would become opt-in. - Nobody chooses to be tracked. - The whole industry built on tracking users collapses, namely advertisement - Web sites who based their business model on advertisement go under Because of this I bet tha…

> - Browsers would come with the no tracking signal enabled by default (why wouldn't they?) so that tracking would become opt-in. > - Nobody chooses to be tracked. > - The whole industry built on tracking users collapses, namely advertisement > - Web sites who based their business model on advertisement go under This seems like the perfect outcome to me, but I doubt we'll be this lucky

Maybe I'm soft, but I always ad block and yet I don't think millions of people losing their jobs, and the resultant economic depression causing millions of other people to go hungry/homeless is a perfect outcome.

Re: Please stop putting cookie pop-ups on your website (2022)

#123

Post by Ferret7446 »

kalaksi wrote: post #73
o_m wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For that to work users have to spend money on their services. I hope that will happen in the future, but until then it is hard to compete with free services that has ads.

They probably still track you even if you paid money, so that makes paying less enticing. And it's prudent to assume so unless they clearly state otherwise

That's because you're not paying enough. If you pay enough, you absolutely can get non-tracking products.

Of course, people either aren't willing or can't. Them's the breaks.

Re: Please stop putting cookie pop-ups on your website (2022)

#124

Post by GJim »

Earw0rm wrote: post #97
mrweasel wrote: post #65

Maybe stop doing stupid shit that will legally require you to inform users that you're about to sell/share everything you know about them to 3rd parties? I fail to understand companies that display page after page of cookies and tracking stuff for you to approve don't see the issue with their actions or the insanity of "allow us to share data with our 1500 partners". Does no one in these business look at this and go:…

Presumably the partners are brought in en masse via some third party brokerage/aggregator service. It's not like a news site is selecting and managing 1500 different partners individually.

This is not an excuse!

I can only imagine the disbelief and laughter in court if a thief said "Your honour, it's not like I stole one car, I actually stole 1500 different ones"!

Re: Please stop putting cookie pop-ups on your website (2022)

#126

Post by simonbarker87 »

mrweasel wrote: post #120
simonbarker87 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdotally for the three ecom businesses I’ve run/worked at it’s been our only method of profitable marketing. As usual it’s the extreme ends of the spectrum that ruin for everyone.

I haven't been in that line of business for 10+ years, so my understand and reference is also a bit out of date. Retargeting did very little. Ads helps in some cases, but rarely generic ads, it had to be extremely targeted, which was normally done by manually buying ad space with certain TV programs or in specific locations. The big ones for us was price comparison sites, if we could get on HotUKDeals we'd have a gre…

Agree, retargeting was a waste of money - it essentially just annoyed people.

Re: Please stop putting cookie pop-ups on your website (2022)

#127

Post by kuba-orlik »

> If a site does comply with the notice and consent requirements, it is not legally required to provide the service if a user declines tracking cookies.

That's simply not true. In order for consent to be valid under GDPR, the service should operate normally if you decline tracing cookies. Otherwise it's considered a "forced consent" and is not valid.

Re: Please stop putting cookie pop-ups on your website (2022)

#128

Post by dusted »

wvenable wrote: post #45
dusted wrote: post #7

The cookie policy is a stupid value-signalling stunt with only negative real-life effects. The correct way of handling the problem would have been through request headers and browser settings, or simply, use the existing option of either allowing or disallowing cookies, and put this option on a per-site basis and a bit more into the users face..

Request headers aren't going to do anything. Browser settings, maybe. If browsers were not owned by advertising companies, they'd just disallow this tracking and that would be the end of it.

This also solves nothing. It's up to the ethics of the company how they chose to group "none" "essential" and "all" and what kind of server-side tracking they do anyway.. It's no harder to do the wrong thing with the current system, but at least the headers would be invisible to the user.

Alternatively: Only allow the website to set cookies if it presents headers with the different options, in a standardized way so the user can chose to pre-set a preference and not be bothered with the cookie nag modal.

Re: Please stop putting cookie pop-ups on your website (2022)

#129

Post by GJim »

imiric wrote: post #66
yobbo wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Besides cookies, there are tracking methods based on fingerprinting, IP and so on. None of them are permitted without explicit consent. This means that a site may not load resources from a third-party server without consent, since the request itself reveals enough information for fingerprinting and tracking. Tracking is plainly not permitted without consent.

> Tracking is plainly not permitted without consent. According to some poorly thought out law in certain territories, sure. In practice, however, there is no technical mechanism by which users, or anyone else for that matter, can detect whether they're being tracked or consent to it. There are browser extensions conscious users can install to block certain browser features, but these are not infallible, and they're c…

> there is no technical mechanism....

sigh There is the law.

The law that legitimate companies obey.

Such data protection law means I can trust my bank will not track me and provide my personal data (all the booze and fags I've spent money on) to my insurance company, and my insurance company cannot accept such data gathered 'unfairly'.

The only people who object to such data protection laws are scummy tech companies who haven't yet understood unnecessary personal data is now a liability, not an asset.

Re: Please stop putting cookie pop-ups on your website (2022)

#130

Post by GJim »

simonbarker87 wrote: post #104
matheusmoreira wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't matter what they want. It doesn't matter why they want it. They are not entitled to this information. They should not be able to know anything at all about us without our explicit consent. We should not have to sacrifice our privacy and peace of mind so that businesses can succeed. If they can't succeed without surveilling us and selling us out, then let them go bankrupt.

If that’s where this all shakes out to it will have the affect of creating retail monopolies worse than even in the pre internet days as marketing will be simply too expensive for many online small businesses. 90% of Shopify stores would be dead in the water.

Don't be silly!

Nobody is stopping anybody from advertising or marketing. Simply that if your advertisers wish to track me, then they must ask my specific opt-in permission to do so. And so they should.

If your business cannot survive without illegally (!) tracking and trading in personal data, then you have a scummy business model and a business that has no right to exist.

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