EU ChatControl is back on the agenda • Hacker News Board

Re: EU ChatControl is back on the agenda

#231

Post by simion314 » Sat, Aug 31, 2024, 3:23 PM UTC

vetinari wrote: post #227

simion314 wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My initial comment was not clear, by I am referring of Hungarian citizens that are part of other countries like Romania, this people do not have relatives in Hungary, never lived there, will not move there.

Is it still a thing? AFAIK the neighbor countries protested against it as a passport of convenience. Some even made laws, that when you accept such a citizenship, you are going to lose your previous one. That curbed the enthusiasm for such citizenship rather significantly.

It is still a thing, Romania also does the same thing where we give citizenship to Romanians on territories we lost like R. Moldova so would be hypocritical for Romania to complain about Hungary, ,my personal opinion is that is not democratic if someone votes but they or their family are not affected by the vote. It would be like some jerk In UK gifts citizenship to people in ex colonies and then those people as gratitude wll vote for the jerk.

Re: EU ChatControl is back on the agenda

#232

Post by simion314 » Sat, Aug 31, 2024, 3:30 PM UTC

vetinari wrote: post #229

simion314 wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Yes, this is what the (modern|progressive|educated|whatever) tell to themselves to fell on high horse in their bubble. Right, the peasants with no education and only watching state TV are clearly the ones without a bias, their children that went to university, got a good job, know english are the one brainwashed by CIA/Israel and the evil LGBTQ. I read so many cases of educated Hungarians or Russians ashamed of the…

Yes, because the friculins (as in free-cool-in) in their reddit bubbles are so much more clever. Case in point; any discussion involving policits here, on hn. Politologs are face palming at the naivety, when they see an extract.

If you would know Romanian I would share with you links my parents share with me and have you defend that bullshit to prove that my parents are the correct ones when they fall for the online bullshit like medical stuff (or you will claim that this less educated people are wrong when they fall for medical bullshit but when is about election they are correct).

Latest link from my father was a clip from some TV channel where some pretend doctor was claiming something super vague that is scientifically incorrect, this time I ignored it since I was not in the mood to try to find evidence that the guy is not a real doctor, that the vague shit is bullshit and find scientific shit to clarify things, and all would need to be in Romanian so he can understand.

For this old generation if is on TV or internet and some scammer pretends is a doctor and uses a few medical words they will fall for it, is the same with politics especially blaiming bad stuff on various groups, that stuff works well on the internet.

Give me an example where your or a friend uneducated pessant parents were actually correct in this kind of topics then their educated children that know more languages and read more media.

Re: EU ChatControl is back on the agenda

#233

Post by I_am_tiberius » Sat, Aug 31, 2024, 3:40 PM UTC

the_mitsuhiko wrote: post #169

I_am_tiberius wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are there Austrian surveys backing this?

I doubt you would see it on surveys. However there is a lot of very noticeable lobbying about this. Our school has a parent group that organizes events to inform parents about the dangers of social media and online grooming. You will find leaflets, PDFs etc. If you are interacting with those circles you will find folks who made it their life’s mission to protect children and who are lobbying for this. You donut need…

Ok, I'm Austrian and don't know of anyone who would support this. But I'm not a parent. I think this is a classic example where a referendum makes sense.

Re: EU ChatControl is back on the agenda

#234

Post by dandanua » Sat, Aug 31, 2024, 3:48 PM UTC

mrtksn wrote: post #224

dandanua wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a struggling single mother loses her life savings because she fell victim to a phishing scam I thought the banking system was designed to reverse transactions (unlike cryptocurrencies). Why do you need finding the scammer for that?

Scammers don't keep their money in the account they used to scam people into wiring their money in. A common case is to use other people's accounts(sometimes stolen, sometimes rented) or purchase something like crypto, gold or anything else that is expensive and easy to move. Often times the seller also doesn't know they are selling to a scammer, there's this technique where the scammers will give the account number…

So, in short, scammers can launder money in minutes, but investigators need months to track them and reverse everything. Yet, I don't think ChatControl will solve anything.

Re: EU ChatControl is back on the agenda

#235

Post by floydnoel » Sat, Aug 31, 2024, 3:49 PM UTC

cjpearson wrote: post #137

ajsnigrutin wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's be fair, in a real democracy, there would be no government secrets... I mean.. we're paying for all that, we need to know. Imagine being an owner of a company, and having some middle managers talking stuff in secret and saying that you don't need to know stuff, just let them use the money, and you don't even get to see the contracts.

It's not too different in the corporate world. I'm an owner of Apple, Google, Microsoft and others and they refuse to divulge their secrets to me. I can't see their contracts, strategy documents or root passwords.

you have a choice of whether to own Apple or Google.

the government offers no such choice, it is a monopoly.

the government is not a corporation.

Re: EU ChatControl is back on the agenda

#236

Post by mrtksn » Sat, Aug 31, 2024, 3:59 PM UTC

dandanua wrote: post #234

mrtksn wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Scammers don't keep their money in the account they used to scam people into wiring their money in. A common case is to use other people's accounts(sometimes stolen, sometimes rented) or purchase something like crypto, gold or anything else that is expensive and easy to move. Often times the seller also doesn't know they are selling to a scammer, there's this technique where the scammers will give the account number…

So, in short, scammers can launder money in minutes, but investigators need months to track them and reverse everything. Yet, I don't think ChatControl will solve anything.

I agree, it won't solve anything. Maybe in short term some idiots will get caught but the criminals will quickly learn their lesson and use other tools and avoid the surveilled ones.

Re: EU ChatControl is back on the agenda

#237

Post by the_mitsuhiko » Sat, Aug 31, 2024, 4:29 PM UTC

I_am_tiberius wrote: post #233

the_mitsuhiko wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt you would see it on surveys. However there is a lot of very noticeable lobbying about this. Our school has a parent group that organizes events to inform parents about the dangers of social media and online grooming. You will find leaflets, PDFs etc. If you are interacting with those circles you will find folks who made it their life’s mission to protect children and who are lobbying for this. You donut need…

Ok, I'm Austrian and don't know of anyone who would support this. But I'm not a parent. I think this is a classic example where a referendum makes sense.

A referendum might be beneficial because it has the chance to make a lasting decision. What is happening here is that the people that care keep fighting for it.

Re: EU ChatControl is back on the agenda

#238

Post by even_639765 » Sat, Aug 31, 2024, 4:40 PM UTC

hnlmorg wrote: post #201

vasco wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What the GP was referring to was those jailed for inciting violence and hatred during the wave of riots the UK suffered last month. My friend, I didn't refer to that at all, there's no need to lie. You were referring to those cases, not me.

Then perhaps you can share what other recent cases there have been of people jailed for posting stuff online. And please don’t call me a liar. You said it was recent, and they were jailed. I don’t know of anything else besides the incidents I’ve covered. Worst case is I’m misinformed. And if that’s the case then I’m sorry. But I assure you that I’m not a liar.

UK law is far stricter than you might suppose.

https://fee.org/articles/uk-man-arrested-for-malicious-commu...

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/arrests-for-offensive-...

Re: EU ChatControl is back on the agenda

#239

Post by even_639765 » Sat, Aug 31, 2024, 4:41 PM UTC

pelorat wrote: post #111

cpursley wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still can’t get over that the UK arrests people over social media posts. Is the US the only place on the planet that actually has free speech?

> Is the US the only place on the planet that actually has free speech? Yes, USA is indeed the only country on the planet with absolute free speech. Most residents of other places doesn't actually want what the USA has.

Most residents of other places doesn't actually want what the USA has.

How do you know this?

Re: EU ChatControl is back on the agenda

#240

Post by aguaviva » Sat, Aug 31, 2024, 4:45 PM UTC

sharpshadow wrote: post #81

sharpshadow wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Orban doesn’t need to crack down on political opposition he has a strong majority in his country.[1] I guess you have a wrong opinion about Hungary and Orban because the media doesn’t like him because he is a pain in the ass for many plans of the European Union and gets bad reporting. Hungary has by the way not even 10 million residents. 1. https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/hungarians-vote-orbans-...

Btw after Hungary got the Presidency of the Council of the European Union[1] in July Orban made a trip to Ukraine[2] which was fine for the media until he went directly afterwards to Russia and then to China[3] which the media didn’t took very well. To finish off his trip he went to the USA to meet and endorse Trump.[4] The media wasn’t really happy with that either. But overall he is one of the only European leaders…

But overall he is one of the only European leaders which speaks with all relevant parties and tries to stop the conflict in Ukraine.

They may not be making visits to Moscow to kiss Putin's hand, like Orban did. But the governments of all the major European countries are continually in contact with the relevant parties, and they all want to "stop the conflict in Ukraine". It's just a question of under which terms.