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For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

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Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#421

Post by alright2565 »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #395
alright2565 wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's look at this paragraph, which is the only real difference between the GPL & AGPL, because I think the English is perfectly clear and understandable: > Notwithstanding any other provision of this License, if you modify the Program, your modified version must prominently offer all users interacting with it remotely through a computer network (if your version supports such interaction) an opportunity to receive th…

> I think the English is perfectly clear and understandable. Because you are not a lawyer. The points I’ve made have been cited by actual lawyers. Your opinion as a technologist blinds you to the degree of legal ambiguity. https://opensource.google/documentation/reference/using/agpl... https://writing.kemitchell.com/2021/01/24/Reading-AGPL Also, the very fact that these opinions exist shows this license is not safe.…

> https://opensource.google/documentation/reference/using/agpl...

If you have some background knowledge of Google's architecture, this explains exactly why the AGPL is banned there: all code is built from one monorepo where everything is linked together.

> https://writing.kemitchell.com/2021/01/24/Reading-AGPL

This completely agrees with what I said. At it's core, the A part of the AGPL only kicks in if:

> “you modify the Program” and > “your [modified] version supports such interaction [remotely through a computer network]”

Yes he calls out various potential problems and a potential loophole, but those same problems are also present in the regular GPL!

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#422

Post by freeone3000 »

freeone3000 wrote: post #258
mightyham wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whether you agree or disagree with what the Mozilla foundation does, it seems fairly matter of fact to say that they are pursuing liberal policies and that posts from the leadership, like the couple below, employ a good bit of leftist rhetoric. https://blog.mozilla.org/en/mozilla/first-steps-toward-lasti... https://blog.mozilla.org/en/mozilla/leadership/mozilla-racia...

Seems like standard centre-left to me: no issues with current ideas of capital or governance structures at all!

Quick primer:

Radical right: “Almost nothing great has ever been done in the world except by the genius and firmness of a single man combating the prejudices of the multitude.”

Far-right: “I know there are some who become sick when they see black uniforms… but those who come to fear us at any time must have a guilty conscience before the nation.”

Right: “This means that every Canadian will see their income taxes go down. This means more money to pay the bills, to save up for your kids' education or maybe even finally afford a family vacation.”

Centre: “There is nothing which I dread so much as a division of the republic into two great parties, each arranged under its leader, and concerting measures in opposition to each other.”

Left: “To put it bluntly, no one should be faced with a choice that says, in effect, “your money or your life”. “

far left: “ The role of the police and the military is growing, and the links between these enforcers of ruling class power and far-right and fascist parties and movements, are becoming more visible.”

Radical left: “ They openly declare that their ends can be attained only by the forcible overthrow of all existing social conditions.”

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#423

Post by temporarely »

hilbert42 wrote: post #222
temporarely wrote: post #162

Enough of this waiting for virtuous entities to address legitimate concerns of the public. The "ad industry" is a cancer and we need legal protection against this "industry". The solution is political not technical and definitely can not be left to "the market". Haven't you had enough?

"ad industry" is a cancer and we need legal protection..." Absolutely true, but how do you expect that to happen or come about? Rampant advertising is similar to the copyright law problem. The majority of users may not like what's happening but their opposition and or dislike is but mild so when it comes to political action it collectively amounts to little more than nought. On the other hand, advertisers, like copyr…

> Absolutely true, but how do you expect that to happen or come about?

In the same manner through which legal protection for various other matters have come about. By raising awareness, sharing thoughts and solutions, and organizing.

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#424

Post by gjm11 »

closewith wrote: post #382
gjm11 wrote: post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The advertisers get your data either way, so why not use Chrome? You might believe that the advertisers get less of your data if you use Firefox. Similarly: you might be less likely to have your house burgled if there are locks on the doors and a burglar alarm, even though people with those things still get burgled sometimes. You might be less cold outdoors in winter if you wear a parka, even though it's still cold…

> You might believe that the advertisers get less of your data if you use Firefox. Shortly as Chrome implements Privacy Sandbox, both Chrome and Firefox will support the same levels of advertising tracking. For Chrome, this is a privacy upgrade of sorts, but for Firefox, this is a definite downgrade. As Firefox converges on Chrome in this area, the privacy advantage evaporates.

Does Chrome do anything equivalent to Firefox's "Enhanced Tracking Protection"?

Chrome forces extensions to use "Manifest v3" rather than "v2", which cripples some ad-blockers; in particular, the full version of uBlock Origin will run on Firefox but not on Chrome. (I'm not sure of the details about the v2->v3 migration; maybe that isn't universally true yet. If not, it will be soon.)

"Reduces" and "evaporates" are not the same thing. I see the case for the former, not for the latter.

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#425

Post by defulmere »

rascul wrote: post #401
defulmere wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for providing these instructions. My usual way to get to some setting in Firefox is to use the search box but it seems that Mozilla is actively hiding this one by excluding it from search, ie if you type "advertising" into the settings search box then there are no results.

It seems the search matches on the text of the option, not the section text. The text of the option is "Allow websites to perform privacy-preserving ad measurement" and the search for me brings up the option (and of course anything else that matches) when I search for any of that.

Ah, thanks for pointing that out. I'd expected a match on the section heading :\

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#426

Post by throw10920 »

dartos wrote: post #326
throw10920 wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please don't engage in this blatant political activism and flamebait here. This is anti-intellectual and not what I want to see on HN. I agree that something needs to be done about the ad industry and rampant data collection, but your emotionally manipulative comments are not it, and actively make it harder to discuss solutions to the problem.

How so?

> Enough of this waiting for virtuous entities to address legitimate concerns of the public.

> The "ad industry" is a cancer and we need legal protection against this "industry".

Emotional pleading, charged language, snuck premises.

> The solution is political not technical and definitely can not be left to "the market".

Obvious political pandering/dogwhistling.

> Haven't you had enough?

Obvious call to action.

Throughout the whole comment, zero logic or reasoning, zero useful information, zero actual solutions presented.

This comment is devoid of any value whatsoever and completely inappropriate for HN.

I wouldn't even want this on Reddit.

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#427

Post by account42 »

Klonoar wrote: post #101
latexr wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It’s clear in retrospect that we should have communicated more on this one What isn’t clear, in retrospect or otherwise, is why companies/apps/services need to keep learning this lesson. The user outcry was utterly predictable from even before the first web article was out. The fact that no one with decision power at Mozilla saw it coming is worrying: either they have zero understanding of people’s concerns for pri…

> The fact that no one with decision power at Mozilla saw it coming is worrying: either they have zero understanding of people’s concerns for privacy or they don’t care. Or the third option: they feel the tradeoff of HN & co's criticism style is not a big deal in the end. Criticism of Mozilla in general is very warranted right now, but the way(s) in which everyone is doing so just feels very out of touch with the act…

Yes, Mozilla should not be experimenting on users without explicit consent. Have things really gotten so bad that this is incomprehensible?

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#428

Post by account42 »

latexr wrote: post #371
vetinari wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Mozilla in particular is frequently pulling crap like this and getting flak for it. They have to constantly apologise and back track. After a while you’d expect they learned something. Well, they learned: they fuck up, backtrack & apologize (it is free, no real impact, so no worries), and life goes on.

> no real impact Apart from a market share that is continuously tending towards zero.

That hasn't impacted their salaries so far though, especially that of the leadership.

Re: For advertising, Firefox now collects user data by default

#429

Post by toldyouso2022 »

deely3 wrote: post #16
toldyouso2022 wrote: post #14

[flagged]

> when instead jail time for spying like the perverts they are is what should have happened. Can you elaborate? Please?

Spyware is illegal. Jail all CEOs, managers, engineers that worked on spying features at google, ms, etc

They are repleaceble and next gen will not dare to spy on users.

Fines are stupid and don't work anyway.

This is in full compliance with the democratic process, judicial tradition, etc so I'm not ranting, instead it is that we have been so removed by the idea of punishing the actual people that do actual crimes just because they work in megacorps that any suggestion to do so sounds like a commie rant.

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