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Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

medicalxpress.com

141–150 of 358 posts

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm being productive by pushing back and saying that when people say that autism needs to be cured and prevented, that they shouldn't say that, because autism doesn't need to be cured and prevented. It's not a disease, but in this society it is a disability, and there's a stigma and lack of understanding around autism in general. What we can do today to make life better for autistic people everywhere is to spread awa…

Of course society should become more accepting and accommodating of differently-abled people of all types. But can you really look at the extreme end of the Autism spectrum and say that isn't a disease or disorder? One reason we need this fundamental research is to disentangle the different types of afflictions and give them different names.

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Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#142

Autism is rooted during fetal brain development. Behavioural and metabolic changes show up later. There is no an egg and chicken problem. The primary disease starts in the CNS and everything else follows

There’s so much brain development that happens in the first few years after birth that there’s absolutely no way you can say that with confidence.

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#143
post #4

I feel like this is going to be used by pseudo-science influencers to push trendy diets to prevent autism when this study is observations stage at best.

Does this mean that they'll start getting their kids vaccinated?

I fear it will be both that crowd and the anti-covid vaccine blind trust of joe rogan guest crowd

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand the sentiment, but there's a reason it's called the autism spectrum. I work with several software engineers with autism who are as capable as their peers. Sure they may have behavioral quirks, but not significantly more so than the normal variation in human behavior. Their brains don't seem to work in an inferior or problematic way, just different. On the other hand, I have a close relative with more sev…

Indeed, my ex wife was incapable of living on her own or holding a job. I have a whole social circle of autistic friends of different abilities. Some still live with their parents. Men in their 40s living with their parents. Women who left home for the first time at 30 only to have to move back within months. My one friend is a sex worker because she can't hold down a real job. She sells her meds and her body to get…

> My ability to type this message and read is not a constant. There are times when I am non verbal. There are times when I cannot read because the letters are all jumbled in my head. When I'm able to read and write and speak, society values me. When I'm not, society devalues me. You want to take autism out of the equation so that I can be valuable to society.

> What I'm saying is that society needs to be reoriented so that autistic people are valued whether or not they can read or write or speak.

People like to say stuff like this on social media, but I can never quite figure out what they actually mean. Society emerges from interactions between people. If someone can’t communicate, how exactly are they supposed to participate fully in society? All people deserve love and support and dignity regardless of their ability to contribute economically, but I’m curious what this “reorientation” would actually mean in practice.

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand the sentiment, but there's a reason it's called the autism spectrum. I work with several software engineers with autism who are as capable as their peers. Sure they may have behavioral quirks, but not significantly more so than the normal variation in human behavior. Their brains don't seem to work in an inferior or problematic way, just different. On the other hand, I have a close relative with more sev…

Then people should stop conflating the two. This whole "spectrum" nonsense is nonsense. Your coworkers are not autistic - they are weird or whatever other more PC term you might want to use, and that's great - many, if not most, great engineers are!. There is no need to pathologize differences in people. Your relative, by contrast, is. If you have a habit of feeling sleepy at work, it's not like we say you're on the…

There’s this thing people online tend to do where they’ll take a well-defined word or phrase like autism spectrum disorder and just decide that it actually should mean something else and get mad when everyone else uses the word in the “wrong” way. It consistently derails conversations, and it almost never brings anyone around to a place of greater understanding.

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#146
post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those people often link to papers that directly contradict the claims they make, assuming no one is going to check them. This won't make a difference.

yea example now there are guys in this comment section claiming keto has cured their adhd/autism. Helped reduce symptoms, sure, but cure? (I've got both of them been on keto, like crazy strict ensuring i was in ketosis every two days type, and it only reduced brain fog personally)

Whenever you get an HN story that even remotely brushes up against health, fitness, or nutrition, you inevitably get all the wacky exercise, supplements, and diet commenters coming out of the woodwork to tell you all about "what worked for me". It's a constant that you can 100% count on every time.

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you square that with the severe cases of autism? The people who will never be able to live independently?

There are also non-autistic people who aren’t able to live independently.

Absolutely, but nobody tries to dissuade people from finding a cure to most conditions that stop independent living.

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm being productive by pushing back and saying that when people say that autism needs to be cured and prevented, that they shouldn't say that, because autism doesn't need to be cured and prevented. It's not a disease, but in this society it is a disability, and there's a stigma and lack of understanding around autism in general. What we can do today to make life better for autistic people everywhere is to spread awa…

Of course society should become more accepting and accommodating of differently-abled people of all types. But can you really look at the extreme end of the Autism spectrum and say that isn't a disease or disorder? One reason we need this fundamental research is to disentangle the different types of afflictions and give them different names.

You don’t even have to go to the extreme end. Ask people with milder presentations, and they’ll be able to tell you about all sorts of confusing interactions and frustrating situations they’ve experienced that wouldn’t have happened if they were neurotypical. Hard to say that doesn’t impact their quality of life.

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#149
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's completely incorrect. Autism has clear physiological differences in the brain. It's not just a personality difference. People like to call themselves autistic when it's just social awkwardness, and some doctors might even improperly diagnose them, but these are separate from the condition. https://www.healthcentral.com/condition/autism/autism-brain-... This could help us prevent autism completely.

Here’s hoping. Autism is pure hell for some families. Unless of course self-declared leaders of the ‘neurodivergent community’ declare such efforts to be genocidal, modern eugenics, and so on. Relatedly, I was struck to see the recent breakthrough in curing congenital deafness condemned by members of the ‘deaf community’ on Twitter. So we unfortunately have good reason to expect the same kinds of folly here.

The history of Autistic Psychopathy/Aspergers specifically, which has a direct throughline to the modern concept of autism, is inexorably tied to the history of Austrian and later Nazi eugenics. Sterilisation was supported especially more by Nazi hardliners, although catholics tended to support voluntary abstinence. Involuntary euthanasia was practiced, not openly, against the autistics deemed to be life unworthy of life - of no use to the Volk - who lacked gemüt (Soul, spirit, etc). Those deemed at one time redeemable, but ruined by their parents were also purged. Those deemed more useful, brilliant, geniuses in the sciences, with good Nazi parents, but with lacking gemüt due to their hyper-masculine nature, were to be rehabilitated and treated with patience and understanding, but even there reproduction was to be AT LEAST discouraged. The ideal Nazi autistic was either dead, or like a worker bee, sterile and working tirelessly for the good of National Socialism and the breeding stock Aryans. One of the goals the child welfare system had was identifying which category each child fell into as young as possible, so as to treat them accordingly with haste.

We also have the western eugenics movements, and while autism wasn't really conceived in their heyday, they had much more of a family-centric take on eugenics, although it was still at the time largely oriented around the good of the welfare state.

For the autistic activist, nothing makes more sense than to stymie such research, as autism's diagnostic prevalence expands each year, seemingly driven largely by a loosening definition of autism, so to delay the research which enables eugenics, people are going to see Autistics as having relatively high gemüt and productivity compared to the past, which should discourage eugenics. They plainly value the right/value of the existence of autistics/themselves, above the potential reduction of suffering allowed by such research. Eugenics after all never actually died and remain popular, it's just become politically incorrect to openly admit to supporting or doing it, and we're currently engaging in a quite successful eugenics campaign against downs syndrome[1], oh, and the ongoing eugenics against autistics [2]. Perhaps these autistic activists would have more confidence in such research if modern eugenics were not legal, accepted, and practiced against them? Or perhaps they should just get over their own egos and admit that this research is for the good of the Volk, which is certainly a take I've heard from autistics themselves.

That all being said - metabolic research is probably going to be less controversial than say genetic research, since it's unclear that you can use the former to facilitate selective abortions or screen sperm donors. So I think in this case, the self-declared neurodivergent leaders will let this slide, as if such research can't be used for eugenics but makes autistics more popular it should make eugenics less likely, not more likely.

[1] https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/fully-human/202101/i... [2]. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-3377811/Britain-s...

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#150
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a continuous range of people in between. Where do you draw the line?

This is like asking where to draw the line when somebody is bald. Are you bald if you have 1 hair? Yes. 2? 3? 137? There's of course reasonable room for discretion in saying what is or isn't bald. But it isn't reasonable to say somebody with a full-on afro is on the spectrum of being bald. Literally some of the most high functioning and successful individuals are being diagnosed as "on the spectrum" of what is, in it…

What you call "real" form is just a strong form, and there is no clear line to draw between real and not real autism, or between "completely crippling" and "not completely crippling", etc.
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