How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain • Hacker News Board

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#421

Post by RamblingCTO » Mon, Apr 08, 2024, 6:29 AM UTC

croes wrote: post #319

fleshmonad wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note that I am a German. I would say there are few. Bad education, especially in schools, a broken railway and public transport system, as well as incredibly high taxes. You may say "free healthcare" and a point can be made here, but when you take a look at the high taxes you have to pay, it's not worth it, if your income is above average. All in all it's a mess and I haven't even begun speaking about German people a…

Incredibly high taxes? Denmark has higher taxes. And don't forget Germany has one of the lowest annual working hours in the world https://data.oecd.org/emp/hours-worked.htm

You're misinformed. Second highest tax burden [1], in Europe and the OECD [2].

[1] https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/global/tax-burden-on-labo... [2] https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/eu/tax-burden-labor-europ...

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#422

Post by tcmb » Mon, Apr 08, 2024, 6:29 AM UTC

ffsm8 wrote: post #356

chironjit wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll one up you and say that it's so broken, there are lots of people that basically live on ranges of exceptions. In my case, I was told I was not eligible for the visa I needed but when I spoke to a migration consultant who knew the process, they managed to get it done. I was pretty shocked as this wink, wink, nod, nod style system is not something I expected from this country.

Germany's head of state was involved in the biggest financial scandal of its existence and forgave a corrupt bank that stole millions of taxes just a few years before going into office. corruption is spreading like a plague with no consequence in sight for anyone involved.

Olaf Scholz is the head of the government, Germany's head of state is its president, currently Frank-Walter Steinmeier.

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#423

Post by kristofferR » Mon, Apr 08, 2024, 6:31 AM UTC

theshrike79 wrote: post #363

freyfogle wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh for sure it could be much better in Germany, and I hope that rapidly becomes the case. Definitely digitization needs to come faster. My complaint is simply people imagining it is perfect elsewhere. Really that is not the case, no where is perfect. All the people chiming in about the US being so easy, yes, wonderful. Now let's talk about healthcare and how your health insurance is tied to your employer. Everyone wh…

> My complaint is simply people imagining it is perfect elsewhere. Really that is not the case, no where is perfect. Perfect is the enemy of good. In Finland I can't remember the last time I filled a paper form for anything. And I've gotten new debit and credit cards, opened bank and stock holding accounts for me and my family, renewed _very_ expired passports, applied for multiple loans (200k€+), started a company a…

Yeah, same in Norway. I think the last time I dealt with paper was in 2012, when I had to sign a document to get a .no-domain (before they changed to digital signing). I just signed it with Photoshop instead, since I didn't bother printing and then scanning it.

Everything is digital/easy here and has been it for a long time. Old people can still get a waiver to get government snailmail instead of secure digital mail though.

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#424

Post by wouldbecouldbe » Mon, Apr 08, 2024, 6:34 AM UTC

nicbou wrote: post #171

hariharan_uno wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I completely agree. I have been living here for 8 years, and recently applied for a permanent settlement permit. My application went into a blackhole for more than 4 months, while my existing permit expired, essentially making me a prisoner here (I can stay and work in Germany but if I travel internationally, I won't be allowed entry back). Meanwhile, my applications for a temporary travel permit were unanswered for…

Mine too! My residence permit expired in February, and my appointment is in July. I expect to have a valid residence title again by end of August. Mind you, I applied in December. I will not be able to travel out of the country for most of the summer as I wouldn't be allowed to reenter. They refused multiple times to issue the temporary permit that I'm legally entitled to. I'm having a lawyer ask again, this time wit…

Try Spain, takes years

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#425

Post by RamblingCTO » Mon, Apr 08, 2024, 6:34 AM UTC

MrJohz wrote: post #270

Keyframe wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(rants) yep, you are German alright!

Truly the worst thing about living in Germany is the apparent national hobby of complaining about things that perhaps aren't great, but really aren't as bad as you might think. In practice, German schools are pretty decent, but they obsess about PISA scores and so neglect to ever notice what the schools are doing well. The train networks are fairly extensive, can be quite cheap depending on how you travel, and consis…

I disagree heavily. Just because you have trains going everywhere (that's not a Germany-specific thing) doesn't mean they are allowed to be hours late. The transport system is broken, was destroyed by trying to cut costs in the past.

Same with schools and educators. And don't get me started on healthcare.

Your sentiment is part of the problem to be honest: Germans are always complaining, it's fine as it is bla bla. It is if you compare yourself to third world countries. But we compete with Japan, Switzerland, the nordics and so on. Also note that this is not a sentiment that is only found in Germans but also a lot of (high value) immigrants who move on after touching base. Germany has a lot of potential but utilizes that very little.

Why would I recognize anything positive about the transport system that has a high likelihood of making my trip a nightmare? It's literally the most important thing, to get me from a to b. That doesn't work with massive delays, cancellations, reschedulings and I miss my connections.

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#426

Post by Semaphor » Mon, Apr 08, 2024, 6:37 AM UTC

nicbou wrote: post #397

mdekkers wrote: post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Elsewhere in Germany, bureaucracy tends to be tedious but functional. Data to back up your assertion that it’s only Berlin? I can speak for Düsseldorf, which is a total nightmare. Literally everything folks talk about regarding issues in Berlin also happens as a matter of course in Düsseldorf. A friend of mine is high up in the NRW civil servants apparatus and he confirms it’s fucked across the board in NRW.

I only cover Berlin, but the relocation consultants I frequently talk to will confirm that it's even worse in other medium to large cities. The Berlin immigration office is doing well given the hand it has been dealt.

The immigration office in Lübeck, STB inner city, is overworked like everywhere, but they are competent, friendly, and decently digitalized. From what a US friend of mine who lived in many cities in Germany told me, it’s pretty much an exception, though.

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#427

Post by Ratelman » Mon, Apr 08, 2024, 6:38 AM UTC

niemandhier wrote: post #387

jamil7 wrote: post #382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you gone through the process? The system wasn’t “designed” at all, it’s completely broken and chaotic. It is 100% the fault of this system and not that of the immigrants going through it. Some of the people involved can also be extremely unpleasant to deal with, even if you speak German.

I accompanied several friends through the process. My observation was that by simply changing the view on what is happening and extrapolating how to act based on that one can achieve quite a lot. I told people the following: 1. The person dealing with you is not there to help you, they are simply executing an act of governance. Rather than wanting them to help you, try to help them close their tickt. 2. You are the t…

This is a brilliant view and probably applies to most situations when a person has to process something - not just government and not just Germany. Very, very few people outright don't want to help - if you come in trying to be the light in their day, they'll WANT to help you get your things done quickly and efficiently, and vice versa. A kind reminder, thanks @niemandhier

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#428

Post by RamblingCTO » Mon, Apr 08, 2024, 6:38 AM UTC

rrr_oh_man wrote: post #204

freyfogle wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I now have a German GmbH and had a UK Ltd in the past for 10 years. Definitely there is more seriousness/trustworthiness to a GmbH. I am not sure there are "countless" scams in the UK, but yes, in 10 years of commercial operation did come across a few oddities. Example - a customer (UK Ltd) who declared bankruptcy owing us a money and then then next day founded a new Ltd company and tried to act like he didn't owe us…

> I have not come across this kind of thing in Germany. Oh, it does exist :)

Yeah! Especially rampant is reusing names of closed GmbHs, reopening them, sending out invoices and stuff like that. Or spamming newly created GmbHs with phantasy invoices. Or the scam that's called Abmahnung by lawyers. There's plenty in Germany, so don't be fooled.

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#429

Post by Semaphor » Mon, Apr 08, 2024, 6:40 AM UTC

jamil7 wrote: post #382

niemandhier wrote: post #378

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My sympathy for your troubles, but please keep in mind: Everybody is processing Ukranians and Arabs. The system was never meant for such a rapid influx of people. The people working on immigration are not lazy or unmotivated, they are exhausted.

Have you gone through the process? The system wasn’t “designed” at all, it’s completely broken and chaotic. It is 100% the fault of this system and not that of the immigrants going through it. Some of the people involved can also be extremely unpleasant to deal with, even if you speak German.

Not myself, but I accompanied my wife every time, and she’s now a permanent resident. The last time we just wanted to extend her temporary residence permit, they even advised us that we have no reason to do that and could just apply for permanent residence (which we then did).

Waiting times are annoying, but that is because of an overloaded system, everything else was pretty painless.

Re: How to found a company in Germany: 14 "easy" steps and lots of pain

#430

Post by marenkay » Mon, Apr 08, 2024, 6:41 AM UTC

ffsm8 wrote: post #356

chironjit wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll one up you and say that it's so broken, there are lots of people that basically live on ranges of exceptions. In my case, I was told I was not eligible for the visa I needed but when I spoke to a migration consultant who knew the process, they managed to get it done. I was pretty shocked as this wink, wink, nod, nod style system is not something I expected from this country.

Germany's head of state was involved in the biggest financial scandal of its existence and forgave a corrupt bank that stole millions of taxes just a few years before going into office. corruption is spreading like a plague with no consequence in sight for anyone involved.

If you believe corruption is just spreading now, you missed every single politician since the founding of Germany. Or every other country on the whole planet therefore.

Wikipedia documents that well enough.