Isn't Apple providing side loading for customers in Europe now? Sure, Apple is being petty, but I thought this is was what Epic asked for. Can anyone ELI5 this one?
Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS
181–190 of 1001 posts
Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS
#182Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm not aware of any duty to deal in the DMA.
You don't have a duty to hire in USA, but you can still get in trouble for illegally firing someone for the wrong cause. Same applies here, this isn't rocket science.
Right, the major difference being that Epic is not an employee of Apple and thus cannot benefit from employment law. The terms of their relationship is governed by contract law, and now the DMA.
Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS
#183Earlier quoted context omitted.
> execs could go to jail instead of just their company paying fines as if they're parking tickets? You want to send an executive to jail for cancelling a contract? I’d be curious for a jurisdiction to try this. In my opinion, I wouldn’t want to do business in a place where commercial disputes can be twisted by a political insider into jail time.
Do you also not drive a car in a place where your driving can be twisted into jail time when you hurt people? Why does the concept of personal responsibility for decisions insult you so deeply?
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Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS
#184Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS
#185Earlier quoted context omitted.
Quite an authoritarian take.
Both sides are authoritarian. One is a private company with more money than most countries, one is an economic union nominally representing the people of many countries. I don't know where I fall on this issue personally, but siding with Apple is probably more authoritarian.
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Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS
#186Earlier quoted context omitted.
What will happen if they exit the EU? They will loose more revenue and tank their stock and Tim Apple will get the boot ad EU users will move to Samsungs, Pixels and Nokias and life will go on. You're acting like the EU is some poor country in the outback and not their second biggest market after the US. Or better yet, we fork Android and have a non-Google EU-only appstore similar to Huawei's Andorid fork OS and apps…
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Which lunatic? I heard it form a tech youtuber and on HN.
Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS
#187Earlier quoted context omitted.
What if, and hear me out, execs could go to jail instead of just their company paying fines as if they're parking tickets? Would they still be as cocky?
> execs could go to jail instead of just their company paying fines as if they're parking tickets? You want to send an executive to jail for cancelling a contract? I’d be curious for a jurisdiction to try this. In my opinion, I wouldn’t want to do business in a place where commercial disputes can be twisted by a political insider into jail time.
> I wouldn’t want to do business in a place …
And that's rather the point. Apple earns a lot of money in the EU and much of that seems to be through abusing their position.
So yes, if you're the executive who signs off on something that is so clearly anticompetative, you should own the penalty. Ignorance of the law is not a defense.
That, or leave.
Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS
#188Earlier quoted context omitted.
> threat of a breach of contract is not a breach of contract I don’t know EU law. But anticipatory breach is enough to trigger damages under American law, and “is an excuse for non-performance by the non-breaching party” [1]. [1] https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/anticipatory_breach
There's nothing about some random contracts I can see in DMA. DMA however does say that the gatekeeper (Apple) isn't allow to block or retaliate against competitors. Or users for that matter.
> nothing about some random contracts I can see in DMA
There are laws other than the DMA?
(Anticipatory breach is incorporated into EU law through the UN CISG [1].)
Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS
#189Even setting aside the dubious morality of Apple's rules on iOS, I feel like I'm going insane watching Apple be maximally aggressive. The EU loves regulating! There's nothing they love more! It seems supremely unwise to give them additional excuses to do something they clearly want to do anyways.
> watching Apple be maximally aggressive Sweeney allegedly tweeted that he would breach his contract with Apple. Apple reached out and asked if he was being hysterical for public display. He didn’t clarify. At that point, Epic credibly threatened breach of contract. This is a commercial dispute between multi-billion dollar companies, both of whom charge outrageous platform fees, both of whom seem to enjoy being drama…
Do you have a link to the tweet from Sweeney saying he would breach the contract?
Re: Apple terminates Epic Games developer account, calling it a 'threat' to iOS
#190Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Epic has a 12% fee, while Apple has a 30% fee Epic’s fee is global. Once you sign with them, you pay that on every install. There is also the 5% royalty, which brings the actual fee to 17% since we’re comparing non-small developer figures.
The 5% royalty is for using the unreal engine - they don't enforce that the engine be used in order to appear in their game store, nor do they enforce that unreal engine games can only be sold on their game store.
The outrageous part of Epic’s model is the global application.